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While Amazon has clearly not taken delivery of all 100k vans, they may also not want to do so at the rate Rivian will be able to deliver them soon. If Rivian sc

While Amazon has clearly not taken delivery of all 100k vans, they may also not want to do so at the rate Rivian will be able to deliver them soon. If Rivian scales to the point where they are delivering 10k (or 20k or 30k) vans a year, will Amazon want to deal with that? It's certainly not cheap to buy that many vehicles all at once. Plus it's Amazon's first delivery EV, so they're going to need to be installing a LOT of charging infrastructure. Amazon also wants Rivian to be successful, as AMZN has a 17% stake in RIVN. If they can get a few deals from other major delivery chains, that would do a lot of help both their revenue (because they'd be selling for more than whatever Amazon agreed to pay) and forecast. UPS, Fedex, DHL. Not to mention hundreds of regional and local delivery companies. You could probably also find a lot of smaller groups that do their own delivery (ex Imperfect Foods) and own their own vans, that might be interested in going green ( ex https://blog.imperfectfoods.com/our-commitment-to-being-a-net-zero-carbon-company-by-2030/ https://blog.imperfectfoods.com/our-commitment-to-being-a-ne... ). Worse if Rivian doesn't start to be a player in the EV Cargo space, the market will quickly be completely absorbed by the number of other players who are in the space and actively selling into it ( ex https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEKMvZNkWCQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEKMvZNkWCQ & https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJRNceHBc4o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJRNceHBc4o )

xnx 4y ago
Doesn't seem that complex to install chargers for these vans. Might cost as little as $500/charger. https://blog.consumerguide.com/rivian-ready-amazon-hub-charging-stations-spied/ https://blog.consumerguide.com/rivian-ready-amazon-hub-charg...
- PaulWaldman 4y ago
  Don't forget the required power feed and distribution.
- entangledqubit 4y ago
  I'm curious if Amazon's charger setup will be different than your normal charging setup. Presumably, you want to charge while the vehicle is being loaded so you want the chargers spaced out around the loading bays. (This nice tour video suggests that things may not be as efficient as I thought: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6lO2_2tyfY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6lO2_2tyfY) Those $500 chargers are the at home chargers. I suspect that Amazon would want a more expensive charger that handles higher power to get more energy on-board during a short loading period. As someone else mentioned, the distribution infra is also quite a bit of money.
  - xnx 4y ago
    Pretty sure these vans sit in the parking lot overnight, so they've got hours to charge and don't have to be in any particular spot.
- ShakataGaNai 4y ago
  I'm surprised by the statement of a $500 charger. That's what the L2 chargers at home cost and they are significantly smaller and shorter cables. The Chargepoint CT4000 ( https://www.chargepoint.com/businesses/ac-stations/ct4000 https://www.chargepoint.com/businesses/ac-stations/ct4000 ) has an MSRP of about $9000 ( https://smartchargeamerica.com/electric-car-chargers/commercial/chargepoint-ct4021-gw1-gateway-unit/ https://smartchargeamerica.com/electric-car-chargers/commerc... ). Granted a commercial fleet charging infrastructure does not need all the electronics related to billing, but they would want more detailed (network enabled) monitoring & control tools. Regardless of the unit cost, it's still not inexpensive to run the electrical. Gotta dig up the parking lot, run something like 30amps per parking spot. 1500 amps for 50 parking spaces is nothing to sneeze at, the copper cost alone would be decent. Then gotta repave it all again and install the chargers themselves. So you're looking at maybe $2-5k per parking space, plus the charger unit? Depending on the economies of scale, where power is, etc. Of course, it'll pay for itself which is why businesses will do it. But it's not free. Also, at least today, these vans are driven all day and charging takes overnight. Maybe some don't need a full 8 hour charge (because they don't drive that far), some are used at night, etc. But the needs would be somewhere close to 1 charger per EDV.
coob 4y ago
> Plus it's Amazon's first delivery EV No it isn't, I see Mercedes EV Amazon delivery vans in London all the time: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/10/amazon-electric-fleet-investment-uk-europe https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/10/amazon-el...
- ShakataGaNai 4y ago
  Very cool. I stand corrected. "It's Amazon's first Delivery EV in the United States"

xnx 4y ago

Doesn't seem that complex to install chargers for these vans. Might cost as little as $500/charger. https://blog.consumerguide.com/rivian-ready-amazon-hub-charging-stations-spied/ https://blog.consumerguide.com/rivian-ready-amazon-hub-charg...

PaulWaldman 4y ago
Don't forget the required power feed and distribution.
entangledqubit 4y ago
I'm curious if Amazon's charger setup will be different than your normal charging setup. Presumably, you want to charge while the vehicle is being loaded so you want the chargers spaced out around the loading bays. (This nice tour video suggests that things may not be as efficient as I thought: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6lO2_2tyfY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6lO2_2tyfY) Those $500 chargers are the at home chargers. I suspect that Amazon would want a more expensive charger that handles higher power to get more energy on-board during a short loading period. As someone else mentioned, the distribution infra is also quite a bit of money.
- xnx 4y ago
  Pretty sure these vans sit in the parking lot overnight, so they've got hours to charge and don't have to be in any particular spot.
ShakataGaNai 4y ago
I'm surprised by the statement of a $500 charger. That's what the L2 chargers at home cost and they are significantly smaller and shorter cables. The Chargepoint CT4000 ( https://www.chargepoint.com/businesses/ac-stations/ct4000 https://www.chargepoint.com/businesses/ac-stations/ct4000 ) has an MSRP of about $9000 ( https://smartchargeamerica.com/electric-car-chargers/commercial/chargepoint-ct4021-gw1-gateway-unit/ https://smartchargeamerica.com/electric-car-chargers/commerc... ). Granted a commercial fleet charging infrastructure does not need all the electronics related to billing, but they would want more detailed (network enabled) monitoring & control tools. Regardless of the unit cost, it's still not inexpensive to run the electrical. Gotta dig up the parking lot, run something like 30amps per parking spot. 1500 amps for 50 parking spaces is nothing to sneeze at, the copper cost alone would be decent. Then gotta repave it all again and install the chargers themselves. So you're looking at maybe $2-5k per parking space, plus the charger unit? Depending on the economies of scale, where power is, etc. Of course, it'll pay for itself which is why businesses will do it. But it's not free. Also, at least today, these vans are driven all day and charging takes overnight. Maybe some don't need a full 8 hour charge (because they don't drive that far), some are used at night, etc. But the needs would be somewhere close to 1 charger per EDV.

coob 4y ago

> Plus it's Amazon's first delivery EV No it isn't, I see Mercedes EV Amazon delivery vans in London all the time: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/10/amazon-electric-fleet-investment-uk-europe https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/10/amazon-el...

ShakataGaNai 4y ago
Very cool. I stand corrected. "It's Amazon's first Delivery EV in the United States"