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There are millions of undocumented workers in the US using fake identities to get jobs. Both major parties support this system. Some Republican interests enjo

There are millions of undocumented workers in the US using fake identities to get jobs. Both major parties support this system. Some Republican interests enjoy the access to dirt-cheap labor. Some Democratic interests want immigrants to be able to find jobs despite it being illegal to employ them. So we end up with a system where employers have no easy way to verify that an employee is who they say they are and has a legal right to work any specific job. This is such an easy problem to solve, but entrenched interests would rather we all play dumb and occasionally slap a business on the wrist when they get too far out of bounds. I’d be curious where these kids end up after this. My guess is they will not end up in schools but will rather end up doing undocumented farm work.

legitster 4y ago
> This is such an easy problem to solve Is it though? I'm absolutely an advocate for eliminating all visa/green card restrictions, but I would by no means say it's an easy problem to solve. There are a lot of downstream implications for unions, housing markets, education, Medicaid, etc. I think these are worthy problems to get to, but I absolutely understand why politicians would rather play dumb.
throw93 4y ago
> There are millions of undocumented workers in the US using fake identities to get jobs. How is this related to the story? The story is about companies using children as workers in hazardous job. It’s illegal regardless of their documentation status. Iowa has proposed bill to to legalize exactly this. This is happening because companies don’t want to pay fair wage.
- roenxi 4y ago
  Presumably the children in question lied about their age when they signed up. The most likely scenario is the meat plant offered them the best wage-earning opportunity in the area. If there aren't systems to verify who workers really are then the meat plant might not have had an easy way to find out. Seems plausible as theories go although obviously I only read this press release and moved on. I mean; if the likely outcome was just losing their job these kids would probably have lied to the investigators too. The evidence here is they wanted to work since this isn't a slavery situation. 100 is such a small number in the grand scheme of things. There are much more than 100 children illegally employed in the US. I'd guarantee it. A lot of families need money.
  - throw93 4y ago
    > Presumably the children in question lied about their age when they signed up. That’s not true though. The company knew exactly what they were doing and still they went ahead and doubled down on it. Excerpt from article: “Our investigation found Packers Sanitation Services’ systems flagged some young workers as minors, but the company ignored the flags. When the Wage and Hour Division arrived with warrants, the adults – who had recruited, hired and supervised these children – tried to derail our efforts to investigate their employment practices,” said Wage and Hour Regional Administrator Michael Lazzeri in Chicago.
    - roenxi 4y ago
      Probably. They did just lose a big court case. But if I ask "how old are you?" in an interview and reject anyone who says "17", then all the interviewees are going to say "18". Kids are pretty dumb but they can figure this stuff out. I'd be happy to claim 10 years of Kubernetes experience if I thought it would give me an advantage in the job market, no question. The children in question are already violating local labour laws; claiming to be 18 doesn't really hurt at that point. Although I will note "tried to derail our efforts" is one of those things that could mean anything. People who are innocent might also have tried to derail efforts. Being investigated prompts some funny responses by businessmen.
      - throw93 4y ago
        The age of the kids was in their system. So the children did not lie about their age. It’s weird to defend the company that knowingly illegally employs kids in hazardous job and instead doubt the govt agency that brings this problem to light. > The children in question are already violating local labour laws; No they aren’t. Their age was in company’s system and company ignored it. Also they are “children”. You expect a 13 year old on ideal behavior while grown adults at the company were knowingly breaking the law? > I'd be happy to claim 10 years of Kubernetes experience if I thought it would give me an advantage in the job market, no question 1. Software development is not a hazardous job, 2. You’re an adult.
- Ancapistani 4y ago
  > How is this related to the story? The story is about companies using children as workers in hazardous job. It’s illegal regardless of their documentation status. I don't know about this particular case, but I don't know of any large business that's purposefully hiring children, or people not legally able to work in the US. They're hiring immigrants who are providing false documents. If you're already using false documents and lying about your nationality, lying about your age isn't exactly a huge step. Why _not_ start working as soon as you can reasonably "pass" for the required age? > Iowa has proposed bill to to legalize exactly this. That seems like a different problem entirely. Establishing a culture where counterfeit or stolen identities are commonplace makes it difficult or impossible to ensure the other labor rules are followed even if the company wants to do so. If the company doesn't want to do so, then it's even more difficult to prove intent. "I had no idea that guy was 16. He said he was 19. Here's the driver's license have gave us! Here's his I-9! He said he was 19, how could we have known?" The above could have been said by a company who was honestly unaware of the deception, by one that doesn't care, or by one that is actively marketing to and even "importing" underage immigrant workers. > This is happening because companies don’t want to pay fair wage. This seems like a third issue still. In isolation, paying more would drive increased competition for the job; it would give people _more_ incentive to apply under false pretenses, not less. It's also not clear to me that there is a native workforce in these areas for these jobs, at any rate of pay. Those jobs are difficult to fill because they're seen as low status, not because they don't pay enough. Even today, Tyson provides some of the best-paying jobs in the area where I live. I don't see how increasing that gap even further would change anything.
  - ethanbond 4y ago
    It is not even close to true that most employers don’t know their employees are illegal immigrants. Your view on this is wildly out of touch with reality. Describing it even as “open secret” makes it sound more secretive than it is in practice.
    - Ancapistani 4y ago
      > It is not even close to true that most employers don’t know their employees are illegal immigrants. Your view on this is wildly out of touch with reality. Oh, I know they know. My point is that Tyson (et al) doesn't "officially" know. Their employees are providing documents, Tyson is submitting those docs to the government, and that's that. > Describing it even as “open secret” makes it sound more secretive than it is in practice. Knowing something to be true and being able to prove that thing is true are two very different things.
bruceb 4y ago
Immigration is one of the areas that such blatant lying happens by partisans. We do have defacto open borders. A good segment of Dems politicians and activists try to cover this up. They also misrepresent temporary "humanitarian" visas as being temporary. They are never temporary and always get extended. On the other side is the lack of enforcement on the employer side which a good segment of Rs ignore. Cut off incentives and fewer people will come.
- PuppyTailWags 4y ago
  We do not have de-facto open borders, and this is a huge exaggeration. Immigrants are turned away all the time for all manner of arbitrary reasons. Just because there are large numbers of undocumented people in the country doesn't mean that there isn't border enforcement. Border enforcement is just a hard, expensive problem to solve with no clear vision or leadership.
  - breakingrules 4y ago
    [flagged]
    - PuppyTailWags 4y ago
      I'm literally currently existing in such an immigrant town. We do not have open borders. We have poorly and inconsistently enforced border patrols, which is completely different. I'm not saying there isn't a problem, I'm saying it's important to not exaggerate the problem.
      - yunohn 4y ago
        > We do not have open borders I’m assuming you are aware that no country in the world has fences or patrols of their borders to any significant length, right? The reason is both financial/logistical infeasibility, as well as bipartisan neglect. Without cheap labor both locally and abroad, the Western world would collapse overnight.
- 4y ago
FireBeyond 4y ago
A few years ago in the South, coordinated ICE raids of a bunch of chicken "factories" owned by Tyson netted 800-900 arrests of undocumented employees. Many of them testified that Tyson encouraged and coached them, even provided written instructions on how to deal with various employment/taxation things as someone undocumented. Asked about this at a press conference, and whether there were "any plans to issue fines, or charges/arrests against the company or management at the company who were very much aware they were employing undocumented workers"? DA / prosecutors: "We have not discussed and do not have plans to do so at this time." And to no-one's surprise, no "plans to do so" showed up later, or at all, either.
- klooney 4y ago
  The whole conversation about rural meat packing plants always drives me crazy. They moved them to rural locations, where by definition very few people live, and then suddenly a hundreds of dudes from rural Mexico showed up to work there. So naturally we talk about Americans being lazy and racist when they complain.
  - giraffe_lady 4y ago
    If your entire problem with that cycle is the mexicans who end up working those jobs it's not ridiculous to consider that racism plays a significant role lol.
    - ticviking 4y ago
      The problem is that the company is blatantly trying to undermine the labor protections and quality of life my ancestors fought hard for.
      - foogazi 4y ago
        Maybe it’s your turn now
      - giraffe_lady 4y ago
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
andsoitis 4y ago
> Both major parties support this system. Can this also be more simply stated: Americans support this.
- notch898a 4y ago
  Nah I love for undocumented kids to simply starve when their family hasn't enough money and no safety net since they are "illegal." Put these kids out of work, I'm sure they'll be better off with no money for necessities! In seriousness, the way to reduce child labor is to give all children better options. Outlawing child labor has the effect of cutting off support for those who apparently might have had little other choice.
- pixelatedindex 4y ago
  I would disagree - American citizens have no control over what the Democrats or Republicans say or do. You only have two parties to choose from, and you only choose locally. Indeed there are folks who support it like how they support Team Red or Team Blue, but if you go out on the street Billy The Kid style, I doubt many of them would want kids working in such terrible conditions.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- marcusverus 4y ago
  No need to speculate, there's a lot of polling data on this. Broadly speaking, Americans want A) work visas for immigrants who're here now (75% agree), B) immigration status checks by employers (84% agree), and C) stopping illegal immigration immediately (77%+ agree). A) Would you favor or oppose each of the following as part of legislation to address the issue of illegal immigration? How about -- Expanding the number of short-term work visas for immigrants whose job skills are needed in the U.S.? Favor - 76% Oppose - 23% B) Would you favor or oppose each of the following as part of legislation to address the issue of illegal immigration? How about -- Requiring business owners to check the immigration status of workers they hire? Favor - 84% Oppose - 16% C) How important is it to you that the government takes steps this year to... [control] U.S. borders to halt the flow of illegal immigrants into the U.S.? Extremely important - 43% Very important - 34% Moderately important - 16% Not that important - 7% https://news.gallup.com/poll/1660/immigration.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/1660/immigration.aspx
Tangurena2 4y ago
Back in 2005/2006, there were a number of raids focusing on meat packing plants in the midwest. The investigation started when a routine check of one Immigration employee turned out that she was working simultaneously (well, her name & SSN were) at more than 50 places (and the IRS wanted about $200k in unpaid income taxes). Much of identity theft is focused on the Hispanic names & SSN because those are the ones that companies hiring illegal immigrants need in order to get past the electronic verification systems. If there were actual jail time for complicit managers, there would be no market for illegal immigrants. 0 - https://cis.org/Report/2006-Swift-Raids https://cis.org/Report/2006-Swift-Raids 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swift_raids https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swift_raids The Denver Post used to have the articles online, but they've since been scrubbed.
- foogazi 4y ago
  > If there were actual jail time for complicit managers Managers ? Get for the CEO for wage theft / child endangerment
- nullbyte808 4y ago
  When you use e-verify now, your photo on your ID pops up. So some of these companies must be either doing it by paper or willfully allowing it.
ravenstine 4y ago
This is one of the most blatant examples of how the "Uniparty" works. The Uniparty doesn't even require collusion, although it's not exclusive of it. Both parties can effectively collaborate against the interests of their voters through confluence of different interests sharing the same technique. At the same time, there's no way either isn't completely aware of what the other is doing. What perpetuates this particular issue is that both sides of the Uniparty, for all intents and purposes, represent the same class of citizen whose interests are so divorced from the voters that even the petite bourgeoise isn't in on it since they are the ones whose best interest is to comply with the system as opposed to subvert it. That is unless they want to risk having the fist of God slamming down on their business for a quick buck. The only way I can see the Uniparty destabilizing is if they represented different economic classes. At best, they pretend to, but fewer and fewer people are buying that story anymore.
ROTMetro 4y ago
And millions of Americans getting the identity stolen and dealing with the fallout. The IRS doesn't care that it was someone else working under your identity that didn't pay taxes, they want their money.
cobertos 4y ago
"No easy way to verify that an employee is who they say they are" According to the article, the fined company was alerted they were employing minors in their hiring system, they just ignored it.
mrguyorama 4y ago
> Some Democratic interests want immigrants to be able to find jobs despite it being illegal to employ them. What? What evidence do you have for this assertion?
foogazi 4y ago
> So we end up with a system where employers have no easy way to verify that an employee is who they say they are and has a legal right to work any specific job. What about e-verify ?
nightpool 4y ago
"This is such an easy problem to solve" How? If someone uses a fully faked/stolen identity, with a valid SSN / passport # / etc (which every single company is required to check), how do you propose we catch them?
- etchalon 4y ago
  It's not an easy problem to solve. Anti-immigration advocates have to pretend it is. "Just verify people" is up there with "build a wall".
- j16sdiz 4y ago
  one way of doing that is government maintains a central registry of employment. This, of course, have many other problems.
  - landemva 4y ago
    Th feds already have that in the payroll tax withholding. Investigators could start there for data analysis then make visits to employers.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  RealID was supposed to curtail this. They certainly made it hard enough for real citizens to get ID.
  - code_duck 4y ago
    Which had the not-surprising side effect of making it difficult for people with less resources to vote.
  - Ancapistani 4y ago
    I don't know about Wisconsin, but in my state RealID is entirely optional. When you get a driver's license (or state ID/"Non-driver's license") you have the option to have your fingerprints taken to receive a RealID compliant ID, or not, in which case your ID is valid for only state purposes. I'm a natural-born US citizen, and I opted not to get a RealID-compliant state ID. I have no need for it. I use my driver's license for most things and my passport card when I fly domestic. A RealID-compliant state ID offers me no benefit.
willcipriano 4y ago
Democrats want the cheap labor as well, as illustrated famously: "Who's going to clean your toilets Donald Trump?"[0] [0]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a8INEYLFWwc https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a8INEYLFWwc
- dashundchen 4y ago
  I mean, Trump has knowingly employed undocumented workers for decades while making deportation of said workers part of his campaign. I think that can pointed out as hypocritical.
- calgarymicro 4y ago
  Kelly Osbourne, famed representative of Democrats the nation over.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]

legitster 4y ago

> This is such an easy problem to solve Is it though? I'm absolutely an advocate for eliminating all visa/green card restrictions, but I would by no means say it's an easy problem to solve. There are a lot of downstream implications for unions, housing markets, education, Medicaid, etc. I think these are worthy problems to get to, but I absolutely understand why politicians would rather play dumb.

throw93 4y ago

> There are millions of undocumented workers in the US using fake identities to get jobs. How is this related to the story? The story is about companies using children as workers in hazardous job. It’s illegal regardless of their documentation status. Iowa has proposed bill to to legalize exactly this. This is happening because companies don’t want to pay fair wage.

roenxi 4y ago
Presumably the children in question lied about their age when they signed up. The most likely scenario is the meat plant offered them the best wage-earning opportunity in the area. If there aren't systems to verify who workers really are then the meat plant might not have had an easy way to find out. Seems plausible as theories go although obviously I only read this press release and moved on. I mean; if the likely outcome was just losing their job these kids would probably have lied to the investigators too. The evidence here is they wanted to work since this isn't a slavery situation. 100 is such a small number in the grand scheme of things. There are much more than 100 children illegally employed in the US. I'd guarantee it. A lot of families need money.
- throw93 4y ago
  > Presumably the children in question lied about their age when they signed up. That’s not true though. The company knew exactly what they were doing and still they went ahead and doubled down on it. Excerpt from article: “Our investigation found Packers Sanitation Services’ systems flagged some young workers as minors, but the company ignored the flags. When the Wage and Hour Division arrived with warrants, the adults – who had recruited, hired and supervised these children – tried to derail our efforts to investigate their employment practices,” said Wage and Hour Regional Administrator Michael Lazzeri in Chicago.
  - roenxi 4y ago
    Probably. They did just lose a big court case. But if I ask "how old are you?" in an interview and reject anyone who says "17", then all the interviewees are going to say "18". Kids are pretty dumb but they can figure this stuff out. I'd be happy to claim 10 years of Kubernetes experience if I thought it would give me an advantage in the job market, no question. The children in question are already violating local labour laws; claiming to be 18 doesn't really hurt at that point. Although I will note "tried to derail our efforts" is one of those things that could mean anything. People who are innocent might also have tried to derail efforts. Being investigated prompts some funny responses by businessmen.
    - throw93 4y ago
      The age of the kids was in their system. So the children did not lie about their age. It’s weird to defend the company that knowingly illegally employs kids in hazardous job and instead doubt the govt agency that brings this problem to light. > The children in question are already violating local labour laws; No they aren’t. Their age was in company’s system and company ignored it. Also they are “children”. You expect a 13 year old on ideal behavior while grown adults at the company were knowingly breaking the law? > I'd be happy to claim 10 years of Kubernetes experience if I thought it would give me an advantage in the job market, no question 1. Software development is not a hazardous job, 2. You’re an adult.
Ancapistani 4y ago
> How is this related to the story? The story is about companies using children as workers in hazardous job. It’s illegal regardless of their documentation status. I don't know about this particular case, but I don't know of any large business that's purposefully hiring children, or people not legally able to work in the US. They're hiring immigrants who are providing false documents. If you're already using false documents and lying about your nationality, lying about your age isn't exactly a huge step. Why _not_ start working as soon as you can reasonably "pass" for the required age? > Iowa has proposed bill to to legalize exactly this. That seems like a different problem entirely. Establishing a culture where counterfeit or stolen identities are commonplace makes it difficult or impossible to ensure the other labor rules are followed even if the company wants to do so. If the company doesn't want to do so, then it's even more difficult to prove intent. "I had no idea that guy was 16. He said he was 19. Here's the driver's license have gave us! Here's his I-9! He said he was 19, how could we have known?" The above could have been said by a company who was honestly unaware of the deception, by one that doesn't care, or by one that is actively marketing to and even "importing" underage immigrant workers. > This is happening because companies don’t want to pay fair wage. This seems like a third issue still. In isolation, paying more would drive increased competition for the job; it would give people _more_ incentive to apply under false pretenses, not less. It's also not clear to me that there is a native workforce in these areas for these jobs, at any rate of pay. Those jobs are difficult to fill because they're seen as low status, not because they don't pay enough. Even today, Tyson provides some of the best-paying jobs in the area where I live. I don't see how increasing that gap even further would change anything.
- ethanbond 4y ago
  It is not even close to true that most employers don’t know their employees are illegal immigrants. Your view on this is wildly out of touch with reality. Describing it even as “open secret” makes it sound more secretive than it is in practice.
  - Ancapistani 4y ago
    > It is not even close to true that most employers don’t know their employees are illegal immigrants. Your view on this is wildly out of touch with reality. Oh, I know they know. My point is that Tyson (et al) doesn't "officially" know. Their employees are providing documents, Tyson is submitting those docs to the government, and that's that. > Describing it even as “open secret” makes it sound more secretive than it is in practice. Knowing something to be true and being able to prove that thing is true are two very different things.

bruceb 4y ago

Immigration is one of the areas that such blatant lying happens by partisans. We do have defacto open borders. A good segment of Dems politicians and activists try to cover this up. They also misrepresent temporary "humanitarian" visas as being temporary. They are never temporary and always get extended. On the other side is the lack of enforcement on the employer side which a good segment of Rs ignore. Cut off incentives and fewer people will come.

PuppyTailWags 4y ago
We do not have de-facto open borders, and this is a huge exaggeration. Immigrants are turned away all the time for all manner of arbitrary reasons. Just because there are large numbers of undocumented people in the country doesn't mean that there isn't border enforcement. Border enforcement is just a hard, expensive problem to solve with no clear vision or leadership.
- breakingrules 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - PuppyTailWags 4y ago
    I'm literally currently existing in such an immigrant town. We do not have open borders. We have poorly and inconsistently enforced border patrols, which is completely different. I'm not saying there isn't a problem, I'm saying it's important to not exaggerate the problem.
    - yunohn 4y ago
      > We do not have open borders I’m assuming you are aware that no country in the world has fences or patrols of their borders to any significant length, right? The reason is both financial/logistical infeasibility, as well as bipartisan neglect. Without cheap labor both locally and abroad, the Western world would collapse overnight.
4y ago

FireBeyond 4y ago

A few years ago in the South, coordinated ICE raids of a bunch of chicken "factories" owned by Tyson netted 800-900 arrests of undocumented employees. Many of them testified that Tyson encouraged and coached them, even provided written instructions on how to deal with various employment/taxation things as someone undocumented. Asked about this at a press conference, and whether there were "any plans to issue fines, or charges/arrests against the company or management at the company who were very much aware they were employing undocumented workers"? DA / prosecutors: "We have not discussed and do not have plans to do so at this time." And to no-one's surprise, no "plans to do so" showed up later, or at all, either.

klooney 4y ago
The whole conversation about rural meat packing plants always drives me crazy. They moved them to rural locations, where by definition very few people live, and then suddenly a hundreds of dudes from rural Mexico showed up to work there. So naturally we talk about Americans being lazy and racist when they complain.
- giraffe_lady 4y ago
  If your entire problem with that cycle is the mexicans who end up working those jobs it's not ridiculous to consider that racism plays a significant role lol.
  - ticviking 4y ago
    The problem is that the company is blatantly trying to undermine the labor protections and quality of life my ancestors fought hard for.
    - foogazi 4y ago
      Maybe it’s your turn now
    - giraffe_lady 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

andsoitis 4y ago

> Both major parties support this system. Can this also be more simply stated: Americans support this.

notch898a 4y ago
Nah I love for undocumented kids to simply starve when their family hasn't enough money and no safety net since they are "illegal." Put these kids out of work, I'm sure they'll be better off with no money for necessities! In seriousness, the way to reduce child labor is to give all children better options. Outlawing child labor has the effect of cutting off support for those who apparently might have had little other choice.
pixelatedindex 4y ago
I would disagree - American citizens have no control over what the Democrats or Republicans say or do. You only have two parties to choose from, and you only choose locally. Indeed there are folks who support it like how they support Team Red or Team Blue, but if you go out on the street Billy The Kid style, I doubt many of them would want kids working in such terrible conditions.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
marcusverus 4y ago
No need to speculate, there's a lot of polling data on this. Broadly speaking, Americans want A) work visas for immigrants who're here now (75% agree), B) immigration status checks by employers (84% agree), and C) stopping illegal immigration immediately (77%+ agree). A) Would you favor or oppose each of the following as part of legislation to address the issue of illegal immigration? How about -- Expanding the number of short-term work visas for immigrants whose job skills are needed in the U.S.? Favor - 76% Oppose - 23% B) Would you favor or oppose each of the following as part of legislation to address the issue of illegal immigration? How about -- Requiring business owners to check the immigration status of workers they hire? Favor - 84% Oppose - 16% C) How important is it to you that the government takes steps this year to... [control] U.S. borders to halt the flow of illegal immigrants into the U.S.? Extremely important - 43% Very important - 34% Moderately important - 16% Not that important - 7% https://news.gallup.com/poll/1660/immigration.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/1660/immigration.aspx

Tangurena2 4y ago

Back in 2005/2006, there were a number of raids focusing on meat packing plants in the midwest. The investigation started when a routine check of one Immigration employee turned out that she was working simultaneously (well, her name & SSN were) at more than 50 places (and the IRS wanted about $200k in unpaid income taxes). Much of identity theft is focused on the Hispanic names & SSN because those are the ones that companies hiring illegal immigrants need in order to get past the electronic verification systems. If there were actual jail time for complicit managers, there would be no market for illegal immigrants. 0 - https://cis.org/Report/2006-Swift-Raids https://cis.org/Report/2006-Swift-Raids 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swift_raids https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swift_raids The Denver Post used to have the articles online, but they've since been scrubbed.

foogazi 4y ago
> If there were actual jail time for complicit managers Managers ? Get for the CEO for wage theft / child endangerment
nullbyte808 4y ago
When you use e-verify now, your photo on your ID pops up. So some of these companies must be either doing it by paper or willfully allowing it.

ravenstine 4y ago

This is one of the most blatant examples of how the "Uniparty" works. The Uniparty doesn't even require collusion, although it's not exclusive of it. Both parties can effectively collaborate against the interests of their voters through confluence of different interests sharing the same technique. At the same time, there's no way either isn't completely aware of what the other is doing. What perpetuates this particular issue is that both sides of the Uniparty, for all intents and purposes, represent the same class of citizen whose interests are so divorced from the voters that even the petite bourgeoise isn't in on it since they are the ones whose best interest is to comply with the system as opposed to subvert it. That is unless they want to risk having the fist of God slamming down on their business for a quick buck. The only way I can see the Uniparty destabilizing is if they represented different economic classes. At best, they pretend to, but fewer and fewer people are buying that story anymore.

ROTMetro 4y ago

And millions of Americans getting the identity stolen and dealing with the fallout. The IRS doesn't care that it was someone else working under your identity that didn't pay taxes, they want their money.

cobertos 4y ago

"No easy way to verify that an employee is who they say they are" According to the article, the fined company was alerted they were employing minors in their hiring system, they just ignored it.

mrguyorama 4y ago

> Some Democratic interests want immigrants to be able to find jobs despite it being illegal to employ them. What? What evidence do you have for this assertion?

foogazi 4y ago

> So we end up with a system where employers have no easy way to verify that an employee is who they say they are and has a legal right to work any specific job. What about e-verify ?

nightpool 4y ago

"This is such an easy problem to solve" How? If someone uses a fully faked/stolen identity, with a valid SSN / passport # / etc (which every single company is required to check), how do you propose we catch them?

etchalon 4y ago
It's not an easy problem to solve. Anti-immigration advocates have to pretend it is. "Just verify people" is up there with "build a wall".
j16sdiz 4y ago
one way of doing that is government maintains a central registry of employment. This, of course, have many other problems.
- landemva 4y ago
  Th feds already have that in the payroll tax withholding. Investigators could start there for data analysis then make visits to employers.
kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
RealID was supposed to curtail this. They certainly made it hard enough for real citizens to get ID.
- code_duck 4y ago
  Which had the not-surprising side effect of making it difficult for people with less resources to vote.
- Ancapistani 4y ago
  I don't know about Wisconsin, but in my state RealID is entirely optional. When you get a driver's license (or state ID/"Non-driver's license") you have the option to have your fingerprints taken to receive a RealID compliant ID, or not, in which case your ID is valid for only state purposes. I'm a natural-born US citizen, and I opted not to get a RealID-compliant state ID. I have no need for it. I use my driver's license for most things and my passport card when I fly domestic. A RealID-compliant state ID offers me no benefit.

willcipriano 4y ago

Democrats want the cheap labor as well, as illustrated famously: "Who's going to clean your toilets Donald Trump?"[0] [0]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a8INEYLFWwc https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a8INEYLFWwc

dashundchen 4y ago
I mean, Trump has knowingly employed undocumented workers for decades while making deportation of said workers part of his campaign. I think that can pointed out as hypocritical.
calgarymicro 4y ago
Kelly Osbourne, famed representative of Democrats the nation over.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]