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The capitalist class will always leverage its capital for its own interests. It's an inherent fact of capitalism. The American socialist movement was mostly wi
by whitemary 4y ago
The capitalist class will always leverage its capital for its own interests. It's an inherent fact of capitalism.
The American socialist movement was mostly wiped out during the Red Scare.
- olalonde 4y agoWhat is capitalist about modern banking? It's probably the most regulated industry in existence. Where a practice that would normally be regarded as fraudulent anywhere else (fractional reserve banking) is not only legal but encouraged by government. There's nothing capitalist about it[0]. [0] https://mises.org/power-market/central-banking-socialism https://mises.org/power-market/central-banking-socialism
- whitemary 4y agoA sovereign state in a capitalist society is a capitalist state. A capitalist state always serves, in aggregate, the interests of the capitalist class. Karl Marx showed us how this works 150 years ago and nobody has challenged this part of his analysis to my knowledge. I am familiar with the delusional American libertarian fantasies, but that's just ideological denial. They haven't done any actual analysis of how a government or state works, or who influences it.
- olalonde 4y agoI was referring to capitalism as in "free enterprise" (not as in "anything that happens in a mostly capitalist society"). Many of Marx' central theories were shown to be incorrect (e.g. labor theory of value) and personally, I don't buy the theory of class struggle (it is probably not even a falsifiable theory).
- whitemary 4y agoI didn't ask what you thought of "many of Marx's central theories" and I couldn't care less. I meant exactly what I said and I'm right.
- Bloating 4y agoAnd every instance of communism has devolved into authoritarianism. I take capitalism, thank you
- kevviiinn 4y agoCapitalism is just authoritarianism under corporations, if you think it's so much better then I've got a bridge to sell you
- oivey 4y agoSo you think the government should step in to add regulation to ban fractional reserve banking, and that that would be more capitalist? Your Mises link doesn’t even mention the term.
- wpietri 4y agoSure, but that doesn't mean that we can't fight that. Indeed, I think it means we must work ardently against it. Capitalism's pretty neat, but it has known failure modes like monopoly and corruption.
- whitemary 4y agoIt does mean you can't fight it with little advocacy groups or well-meaning think tanks. According to history, you need a strong labor movement led by principled socialists.
- wpietri 4y agoI think solving problems like corruption takes more than one thing, so I think false dichotomies are unhelpful.
- whitemary 4y agoWhat you call "corruption" is fundamental capitalism. In other words, there has never been and can never be a capitalist society without it. Thinking otherwise is capitalist utopianism. "The government" (or state) is part of capitalism. In fact, it is a critical component. There could be no capitalism without a state to enforce it. Libertarianism is not a coherent ideology; it is a disease of the intellect.
- wpietri 4y agoI meant that as corruption from the perspective of the governmental system. Which either you knew perfectly well or we're talking past one another here, so either way I think I'm done.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago> you need a strong labor movement led by principled socialists The “principled” qualifier works for anything, e.g. we need a strong bank regulator led by principled felons.