3 ms·

From the article: The government says the ETA scheme will strengthen border security...[clip]...under current rules it does not have wholly accurate data on th

From the article: The government says the ETA scheme will strengthen border security...[clip]...under current rules it does not have wholly accurate data on the number of people entering and leaving the country.

mistrial9 4y ago
the CTO of Starbucks stood on stage (pre-covid) in a small setting and told everyone "actually, we do not know how many people work at Starbucks right now" .. dramatic pause.. the explanation is that pending resignation, pending dismissal, no-show, hiring pipeline, even whole stores opening and closing.. means that the EXACT number is not known, but there is state.. and bounds to that state. It was a dramatic way to talk about the inherent difficulty of precise numbers in a very large and active enterprise. So, relate that to the state of border control of an entire nation, and you get the idea..
Broken_Hippo 4y ago
Which seems... Ridiculous. It provides "border security" in the way TSA provides airport security: By showing theater to make certain folks feel better. As far as the number of people: Flights have record of who is on them, and generally require a passport for international travel (even though there are open borders between EU countries). I've not taken a train internationally, but I'd imagine something similar exists there - or can exist, anyway. It doesn't really cover folks driving (Which would make their numbers different), but I suppose there are less routes into the UK by car.
madeofpalk 4y ago
I'm confused how they don't have the accurate numbers. To enter the UK you need to go through Border Patrol, either via a automated gate (where they can count you) or via a person at a booth (where they can count you). If you can't get accurate numbers from that, how would an online form change that?
- dazc 4y ago
  There are lots of small airports where there are Border Patrol staff but I don't think they are counting people in and out as part of any organised and uniform system? Take, for example, recent industrial action where striking staff were replaced with armed forces. Apparently, the system ran incredibly smoothly but I don't doubt a lot of the everyday bureaucracy was overlooked at the same time.
- switch007 4y ago
  > To enter the UK you need to go through Border Patrol Not in every case. Eg arrivals from Ireland. Also I think it’s been politically motivated to hide behind the lie of it being difficult or impossible to count the number of immigrants in the country. Various people/groups believe the UK population is vastly underreported

mistrial9 4y ago

the CTO of Starbucks stood on stage (pre-covid) in a small setting and told everyone "actually, we do not know how many people work at Starbucks right now" .. dramatic pause.. the explanation is that pending resignation, pending dismissal, no-show, hiring pipeline, even whole stores opening and closing.. means that the EXACT number is not known, but there is state.. and bounds to that state. It was a dramatic way to talk about the inherent difficulty of precise numbers in a very large and active enterprise. So, relate that to the state of border control of an entire nation, and you get the idea..

Broken_Hippo 4y ago

Which seems... Ridiculous. It provides "border security" in the way TSA provides airport security: By showing theater to make certain folks feel better. As far as the number of people: Flights have record of who is on them, and generally require a passport for international travel (even though there are open borders between EU countries). I've not taken a train internationally, but I'd imagine something similar exists there - or can exist, anyway. It doesn't really cover folks driving (Which would make their numbers different), but I suppose there are less routes into the UK by car.

madeofpalk 4y ago

I'm confused how they don't have the accurate numbers. To enter the UK you need to go through Border Patrol, either via a automated gate (where they can count you) or via a person at a booth (where they can count you). If you can't get accurate numbers from that, how would an online form change that?

dazc 4y ago
There are lots of small airports where there are Border Patrol staff but I don't think they are counting people in and out as part of any organised and uniform system? Take, for example, recent industrial action where striking staff were replaced with armed forces. Apparently, the system ran incredibly smoothly but I don't doubt a lot of the everyday bureaucracy was overlooked at the same time.
switch007 4y ago
> To enter the UK you need to go through Border Patrol Not in every case. Eg arrivals from Ireland. Also I think it’s been politically motivated to hide behind the lie of it being difficult or impossible to count the number of immigrants in the country. Various people/groups believe the UK population is vastly underreported