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Vote with your dollars, people. Don't buy Apple and Foxconn products if you care about the wellbeing of workers.

spiderice 4y ago
Wait what? Because of 12 hour shifts? Should I not use hospitals either? Or are you referring to other working conditions unrelated to 12 hour shifts?
- ROTMetro 4y ago
  Is someone doing the same task 60 times a minute in the hospital that entire shift minus a lunch break? Do assembly line workers for Apple get treated the same as hospital workers? Not eve close! Do hospital workers have to ask permission to go to the bathroom? Do hospitals have suicide nets to prevent their workers from trying to kill themselves because they have lost all hope? You are talking two very different things.
- cute_boi 4y ago
  How about we also address the issue of hospital working conditions? Nurses shouldn't be forced to work more than an 8-hour shift. While there may be some issues with knowledge transfer during shift changes, there are solutions available that may increase costs but are necessary to prioritize the well-being of healthcare workers. In the case of Apple, it appears they are being driven by greed, and the transfer of knowledge to work in their factories is generally unnecessary. I require people to not support greedy corporation.
alexhjones 4y ago
What’s the next best alternative?
fnordpiglet 4y ago
True. We wouldn’t want women to be able to earn as much as men in India. It’s important to take a principled stand against gender parity and punish these guys with your wallet.
- ROTMetro 4y ago
  We don't want people crippled from abusive levels of hours doing a task at high risk of repetitive stress injury just so that Apple doesn't have to deal with shift changes. They are trading lifetime quality of life issues for their workers (who don't have much other option) for a reduction in shift changes. As someone whose been at the bottom and seen as throway sorting trash at a recycling facility and whose hands still often ache from that job, F! Apple!
  - fnordpiglet 4y ago
    Sorry, but men were already allowed to work these hours and shifts. It was women who weren’t. The shifts still conform to standard work week in India (48 hours). 12 hour shifts are not uncommon anywhere, and they come with generally better pay and more contiguous time off, which can be more meaningful to some people than more time off in a single day. I feel like perhaps the clickbait headline worked and it may be there’s not much of a story here other than women being granted equal footing with men in the labor market.
- JustSomeNobody 4y ago
  Hmmm there's a logical fallacy in there just waiting to be unearthed... I feel it...
- widowlark 4y ago
  Is your argument seriously that it’s unfair that women aren’t overworked in India
  - fnordpiglet 4y ago
    My argument is that it’s unfair that there’s one set of rules for men and one for women. “Overworked” is qualitative call. 4 days at 12 hours is what we are talking about here, which is not an uncommon labor structure in the west or east and has a lot of advantages to the worker. It’s not 12 hours a day 7 days a week. It’s 48 hours a week, a standard work week in India. Those shifts also pay better, and have more contiguous time off. Why, on the basis of their gender, were women not allowed to compete for those jobs against men? Note absolutely no one is forcing anyone to do absolutely anything. It’s just opening the possibility for women to hold a job any man can have. Who are you to tell them they’re wrong for wanting it and should enjoy their station as a woman?
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
qwytw 4y ago
Yes cause other major manufacturers or not exactly the same or (more usually) worse (because the press/public pays much more attention to Apple than to anyone else)
hindsightbias 4y ago
I sleep so much better with my Samsung "Among the most alarming information were reports that miscarriage “is very normal.” As one worker said, “It is very normal if they are young. If they are pregnant … for the first trimester it is very difficult, they miscarry a lot.” https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/14/your-cool-new-samsung-smartphone-brought-you-noise-pain-miscarriages-pham-digangi-column/397173002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/14/your-cool-...
lwkl 4y ago
So don't buy any electronics? It's pretty hard to avoid Foxconn they are used by almost everyone.
cute_boi 4y ago
The sad thing is, there are no other alternatives. I want to move to another platform, but they are littered with tracking and nonsensical ads. Additionally, the hardware is generally abysmal. The good thing is that Microsoft made Windows Phone, and it was somewhat flawless. Unfortunately, they later killed it :(.

Wait what? Because of 12 hour shifts? Should I not use hospitals either? Or are you referring to other working conditions unrelated to 12 hour shifts?

ROTMetro 4y ago
Is someone doing the same task 60 times a minute in the hospital that entire shift minus a lunch break? Do assembly line workers for Apple get treated the same as hospital workers? Not eve close! Do hospital workers have to ask permission to go to the bathroom? Do hospitals have suicide nets to prevent their workers from trying to kill themselves because they have lost all hope? You are talking two very different things.
cute_boi 4y ago
How about we also address the issue of hospital working conditions? Nurses shouldn't be forced to work more than an 8-hour shift. While there may be some issues with knowledge transfer during shift changes, there are solutions available that may increase costs but are necessary to prioritize the well-being of healthcare workers. In the case of Apple, it appears they are being driven by greed, and the transfer of knowledge to work in their factories is generally unnecessary. I require people to not support greedy corporation.

alexhjones 4y ago

What’s the next best alternative?

fnordpiglet 4y ago

True. We wouldn’t want women to be able to earn as much as men in India. It’s important to take a principled stand against gender parity and punish these guys with your wallet.

ROTMetro 4y ago
We don't want people crippled from abusive levels of hours doing a task at high risk of repetitive stress injury just so that Apple doesn't have to deal with shift changes. They are trading lifetime quality of life issues for their workers (who don't have much other option) for a reduction in shift changes. As someone whose been at the bottom and seen as throway sorting trash at a recycling facility and whose hands still often ache from that job, F! Apple!
- fnordpiglet 4y ago
  Sorry, but men were already allowed to work these hours and shifts. It was women who weren’t. The shifts still conform to standard work week in India (48 hours). 12 hour shifts are not uncommon anywhere, and they come with generally better pay and more contiguous time off, which can be more meaningful to some people than more time off in a single day. I feel like perhaps the clickbait headline worked and it may be there’s not much of a story here other than women being granted equal footing with men in the labor market.
JustSomeNobody 4y ago
Hmmm there's a logical fallacy in there just waiting to be unearthed... I feel it...
widowlark 4y ago
Is your argument seriously that it’s unfair that women aren’t overworked in India
- fnordpiglet 4y ago
  My argument is that it’s unfair that there’s one set of rules for men and one for women. “Overworked” is qualitative call. 4 days at 12 hours is what we are talking about here, which is not an uncommon labor structure in the west or east and has a lot of advantages to the worker. It’s not 12 hours a day 7 days a week. It’s 48 hours a week, a standard work week in India. Those shifts also pay better, and have more contiguous time off. Why, on the basis of their gender, were women not allowed to compete for those jobs against men? Note absolutely no one is forcing anyone to do absolutely anything. It’s just opening the possibility for women to hold a job any man can have. Who are you to tell them they’re wrong for wanting it and should enjoy their station as a woman?

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

qwytw 4y ago

Yes cause other major manufacturers or not exactly the same or (more usually) worse (because the press/public pays much more attention to Apple than to anyone else)

hindsightbias 4y ago

I sleep so much better with my Samsung "Among the most alarming information were reports that miscarriage “is very normal.” As one worker said, “It is very normal if they are young. If they are pregnant … for the first trimester it is very difficult, they miscarry a lot.” https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/14/your-cool-new-samsung-smartphone-brought-you-noise-pain-miscarriages-pham-digangi-column/397173002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/14/your-cool-...

lwkl 4y ago

So don't buy any electronics? It's pretty hard to avoid Foxconn they are used by almost everyone.

cute_boi 4y ago

The sad thing is, there are no other alternatives. I want to move to another platform, but they are littered with tracking and nonsensical ads. Additionally, the hardware is generally abysmal. The good thing is that Microsoft made Windows Phone, and it was somewhat flawless. Unfortunately, they later killed it :(.