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More than $70B wiped off crypto market in 24 hours as BTC drops 8% below $20K
- boo-ga-ga 4y agoNot a very good hedge against finance industry issues, yeah?
- codetrotter 4y agoThe article agrees with you > The movement of cryptocurrency prices is quite closely correlated to U.S. stock markets, in particular the tech-heavy Nasdaq This is bad for crypto. In order to be a good hedge, the price movement of Bitcoin should not follow stock markets like this.
- frankreyes 4y agoIt should be clear by now that the BTC is backed by USD.
- antibasilisk 4y agoIt's moreso the case that's the majority of usage is as a middle-man for USD, when you buy something people will usually say '$13 in BTC' as opposed to '14000 sats' for example
- frankreyes 4y agoThat's exactly what happens with the Argentina peso. You pay in pesos for products expressed in USD. And the backing of the peso has always been the USD.
- codetrotter 4y agoYeah, it’s likewise with most companies too probably, if they pay the salary in BTC. The salary will still probably be like “$130k USD per year, but we send it to you in Bitcoin” and whatever the exchange rate happens to be at the day of each pay check determines how much Bitcoin they send you. And in some ways it’s good and in some ways it’s bad. It’s good because at the moment BTC is so volatile. It’d kind of suck if I agreed to some amount of BTC per year in salary and one month I couldn’t even afford rent just because the market rate for BTC was so bad. But I really do hope that one day we can measure so many things in BTC directly, that I could have my pay check in Bitcoin and pay my rent and my food in Bitcoin etc, without regards for what the BTC to USD value is.
- antibasilisk 4y agoIs BTC really that volatile or does the USD have its own volatility we should also factor in? Considering how every currency has been massively devalued over the past 3 years, and considering BTC is less volatile than the S&P 500, I'd say the USD itself contributes significantly to the perceived volatility.
- codetrotter 4y agoIt’s hard to tell for sure. But it is definitely the case that today it is safe for me to receive my pay check in USD, as it allows me to pay my rent and buy my groceries and buy a little bit of BTC for a portion of it. Whereas, receiving my pay in a fixed amount of BTC would be a very big gamble today. Maybe if I move to El Salvador, it could be different :thinking_face:
- petesergeant 4y agoMeh, it was lower three months ago. No fan of crypto, but this is clickbait.
- ajsnigrutin 4y agoYep... a few years of "1BTC will be $1M!!!" and now a few years of "bitcoins will be worthless!" And bitcoins are still here and worth relatively a lot.
- Yizahi 4y agoIt's CNBC, they are peddling tokens usually. Even this news is framed as if 70B$ was really lost, while obviously there was never such amount of liquidity in the token industry and the number was manufactured by meaningless calculation of so called "market cap", to impress gullible people.
- meindnoch 4y agoK. Keep me posted! (Preferably when it goes to zero.)
- user3939382 4y agoSo… bitcoin to the moon let’s f gooo rocketship rocketship ?
- irjustin 4y agoWith SI and SIVB falling off, this is no surprise.
- moneywoes 4y agoMore details?
- chank 4y agoA lot of news about problems with Silicon Valley Bank.
- londons_explore 4y agoWhen Silicon Valley bank closes its doors, there will still be plenty of assets to give to account holders. I would guess nobody will lose more than 5-10% of what they had deposited. So it is interesting that it is causing such panic.
- prasadjoglekar 4y agoThe panic is always due to duration mismatch. A startup won't survive if cash is locked up for 90 days and you can't make payroll. unless a large benevolent buyer steps in, (remember Bear Sterns and JPM?), SiVB is toast. In fact both SI and SiVB are in trouble because they have long duration assets and short duration liabilities.
- londons_explore 4y agoYes, but the duration mismatch shouldn't be an issue here. I would happily loan money to a startup to make payroll, if that loan was 80% of the value of deposits they had in the collapsing SiVB, as long as the loan was secured with those deposits - that way I can be pretty certain I'm getting repaid, even if the startup goes bankrupt in the meantime.
- 4y ago
- realworldperson 4y ago[dead]
- rvz 4y agoLead by the real-time collapsing of the VC pyramid scheme supported by SVB holding funds for lots of unprofitable startups at ridiculously insane valuations. Crypto needed more room to go down with Bitcoin taking everyone with it. Now this time, startups really need to make money rather than raise money every month.
- wouldbecouldbe 4y ago20-30 years and it's back to almost zero.
- nikanj 4y agoNo worries, the Bitfinex people will just conjure up more unbacked Tether to pump the value back up
- senttoschool 4y agoYep. What people don't realize is that Tether is the ultimate linchpin of the crypto industry.
- repomies69 4y agoIf Silvergate had kept their reserves in Tether instead of those 10-year goverment bonds, they would still be chugging along nicely.
- pavlov 4y agoWouldn’t it be amazing if they had actually done that. When the depositors all came asking for their money, Silvergate Bank would have replied: “So, we wired your 11 billion dollars to an unaudited corporation in the Bahamas. No worries, they gave us a cryptographic receipt for 11 billion virtual magic beans! I’m sure we can redeem those for you guys. Hold on, we’ll call their CEO, the man who used to produce Inspector Gadget cartoons in the 1980s… Oh, he doesn’t answer his phone? Telegram group message I guess…”
- progx 4y agoSo capital market increased $70B.
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoUh, no. No one sold crypto, the market just crashed. That is like saying people made money when the down goes down 20%.
- frankreyes 4y agoIt depends... If there's a short seller on 70B then yes.
- 1vuio0pswjnm7 4y agoMaybe $70B in credit but there is no way anyone is going to redeem that much in real currency. How is the $70B number even helpful. Is it supposed to trigger notions of "too big to fail". Who cares how much the Ponzi scheme has taken in. Victims want to know how much it can pay out. The answer of course is not enough. Singh has now flipped on SBF. The outcome of the Ripple case is anyone's guess. Fraud is not difficult to understand.
- mrweasel 4y agoThis may just be me being cynical, but any attempt to convert any significant about of Bitcoins to anything real will collapse the price further.
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoNo, you are not cynical, you are spot on. Crypto gains are worth nothing until you change it into currency. The same is true for stock gains. Crypto gains only were people imagining money into existence. This is the problem of going off the gold standard.
- senttoschool 4y ago>No, you are not cynical, you are spot on. Crypto gains are worth nothing until you change it into currency. The same is true for stock gains. Actually, stocks are slightly different. Because stocks are based on an underlying real company producing real services and goods, it's worth something even if you don't sell it. This is because stocks can pay dividends or do buy backs. Crypto does not pay dividends or do buy backs. If they do, they should be classified as a security.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago> Because stocks are based on an underlying real company producing real services and goods No, they are not. Stocks prices are solely based on their supply and demand in the market. Products and services may play a role in the demand fro the stock, but they are not the sole determinate of price. Take AMC for example...
- quadcore 4y agoTangential. Many think bitcoin is useless and i understand the debate, it clearly has it's legitimacy but "hey, wait a minute" was i thinking the other day, Ive personally used bitcoin to pay for things and I love it a lot more than my banking system. The user experience is just better Ive found. For example, it takes days to wire money or get money for me. Also in France they pushed KYC to a degree its ridiculous. Here you got to fill a full A4 form to move 3000+€ which is ridiculous because the rich and powerful certainly dont do that. I understand KYC protect me and but its not well implemented imo. So in short it's kind of simple: some of us use bitcoin for its UX really.
- deaddodo 4y agoI don't think most people think it's useless. It's more that it's value is heavily overinflated for its market, by hype and cryptobros.
- senttoschool 4y agoMost people think it's useless.
- Gigachad 4y agoCrypto being valuable is mostly useless. If I’m buying a coffee, I don’t really care about the market cap, as long as there is enough value to enable active transactions, it works. Crypto might be the future, but I can’t see any reason why it would be Bitcoin or anything else that exists currently. It’s more likely something will come along with more features later making it more useful for real transactions. Obsoleting the current coins.
- iamben 4y agoWhere are you based? UK to UK (at least) money transfers are usually done in seconds/minutes. We use Wise for international stuff and it's pretty much instant as well. Surely if bitcoin/crypto became the way/ubiquitous, it would end up having the same KYC issues? Not knocking crypto, btw!
- 4y ago
- mnx 4y agoStill remember when 10k USD/BTC was the unrealistic target everyone laughed at. Funny how we blew way past that, but without achieving nearly any real usecases.
- raviguptacyble 4y ago[dead]
- tnel77 4y agoMy favorite part about Bitcoin is the foaming at the mouth that occurs whenever you talk to someone who is anti-crypto. It has little to do with the actual technology and everything to do with the need to be correct about its downfall. “I told you it would go to zero!!” I’ve never seen people so passionately against something like I’ve seen with the crypto space. Edit: In before I get a stereotypical crypto bro response with a bunch of rocket ship emojis Edit 2: Also in before someone rants about Bitcoin’s energy use. “It uses enough electrify to power Jupiter, and has accomplished NOTHING”
- r2_pilot 4y agoI'm anti-crypto because of all the time I have to waste listening to crypto bros about how awesome their digital tulips are. They don't take "I don't want to hear about crypto" for an answer, either
- tnel77 4y agoUndeniably, there’s a large sub-set of the crypto space that’s incredibly annoying and toxic. I do my best to avoid them as it’s just noise that does very little to help the cause.
- irusensei 4y agoAre we still blaming bitcoin for the effects of financial institutions borderline degenerate gambling on phony shitcoins?