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France was not only the biggest military power from the end of the 17th century until late 18th century, but also it was de facto dominant culture in Europe. Ev

France was not only the biggest military power from the end of the 17th century until late 18th century, but also it was de facto dominant culture in Europe. Every other European country took their fashion from Paris, Age of Enlightenment matured in France and was imported from there, and French was lingua franca until early 20th century. The upper classes of all of those major players sent their children to France to study, if they couldnt, the children studied French under French tutors at home. Even Ottoman Empire imported a lot from France - the European diplomacy in the empire started with France, French language was the lingua franca, even the word for 'European' was 'Frenk', and later in late 18th century, French Revolutionary principles were imported. There is no downplaying France in 18th century. It was basically the center of the European world.

hackandthink 4y ago
The germans killed each other in their religious wars. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/population-by-country?time=1500..latest&country=GBR~FRA~DEU~ESP~ITA~TUR https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/population-by-country?tim...
gerdesj 4y ago
"There is no downplaying France in 18th century. It was basically the center of the European world." Centre not center (-re is French/English, -er is mostly American). There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18. "center of the European world" - no, the Parisian meridian effort was eventually ditched in favour of Greenwich, London. Again you persist with the non French -er. I do applaud your deft handling of a Germanic language: "English". English is of course the modern lingua franca - French.
- unity1001 4y ago
  > There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18. Yes, there was. And its mostly unchanged since then after including the changes that the French Revolution brought. And that identity openly and directly took France as its center. The literature, politics, culture, letters and even thoughts of the people who lived in that era, especially the upper classes, demonstrate that unmistakably. Its not something that surfaces by 'interpreting' what they say and reaching a conclusion either - its what they directly say themselves, in writing. > -er is mostly American So?
- inglor_cz 4y ago
  "There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18." There certainly was a concept of "Christendom", which mostly consisted of Europeans and European colonies in the Americas in the 18th century, as a contrast to the lands of Islam, pagan deep Africa and "the Orient" (China, Japan). And demographically, American colonies of that time were an insignificant periphery compared to Europe.

hackandthink 4y ago

The germans killed each other in their religious wars. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/population-by-country?time=1500..latest&country=GBR~FRA~DEU~ESP~ITA~TUR https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/population-by-country?tim...

gerdesj 4y ago

"There is no downplaying France in 18th century. It was basically the center of the European world." Centre not center (-re is French/English, -er is mostly American). There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18. "center of the European world" - no, the Parisian meridian effort was eventually ditched in favour of Greenwich, London. Again you persist with the non French -er. I do applaud your deft handling of a Germanic language: "English". English is of course the modern lingua franca - French.

unity1001 4y ago
> There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18. Yes, there was. And its mostly unchanged since then after including the changes that the French Revolution brought. And that identity openly and directly took France as its center. The literature, politics, culture, letters and even thoughts of the people who lived in that era, especially the upper classes, demonstrate that unmistakably. Its not something that surfaces by 'interpreting' what they say and reaching a conclusion either - its what they directly say themselves, in writing. > -er is mostly American So?
inglor_cz 4y ago
"There was no such concept of a European as we understand it today, back in C18." There certainly was a concept of "Christendom", which mostly consisted of Europeans and European colonies in the Americas in the 18th century, as a contrast to the lands of Islam, pagan deep Africa and "the Orient" (China, Japan). And demographically, American colonies of that time were an insignificant periphery compared to Europe.