6 ms·

That is actually meant to keep the connection to a Bluetooth keyboard/mouse when using the computer in clamshell mode.

by tagyro 4y ago

wyager 4y ago
They don't let me use an HDMI display without external power while closed, so why let me use bluetooth without power?
- shortcake27 4y ago
  The opposite is also true. You can’t officially use a Macbook in clamshell mode (eg, as a headless media server) even when connected to power. When you close the lid without a connected display, the official MacOS behaviour is to put the computer to sleep. You need a third-party tool to prevent it from sleeping. Yet when my Macbook is asleep in my bag with no peripherals attached, my headphones will connect and wake the Mac. The left hand does not know what the right hand is doing. It literally makes no sense.
  - wyager 4y ago
    I think we're agreeing - my point is that it doesn't make sense to allow bluetooth when they won't even allow a display (no power, laptop closed). What are you going to use the bluetooth for, moving a mouse you can't even see?
porbelm 4y ago
...and they could make it so it stays on only of there's an external display connected, but then communication could be disabled by the person who stole your laptop. So Find My would not be able to find and more importantly report a location.
- tagyro 4y ago
  > ...and they could make it so it stays on only of there's an external display connected Not always, my monitor goes to sleep and turns off. At this point, macOS should turn Bluetooth off? How would I wake the computer then? I would have to open it. > Find My would not be able to find and more importantly report a location. That might be another reason why Bluetooth stays on. On a laptop, I'd rather have Find My working in clamshell mode (given the theft risk).
  - Namari 4y ago
    I wonder if there are more people like you or more into turning it off.
    - falcolas 4y ago
      +1 for using a MacBook in clamshell mode most of the time.
    - sethammons 4y ago
      I exclusively use it with the lid closed. However, I use wired everything. I use external speakers, monitor, keyboard, mouse, wacom, and dslr camera for webcam. The only thing wireless is my wifi connection.
  - shortcake27 4y ago
    > Not always, my monitor goes to sleep and turns off. At this point, macOS should turn Bluetooth off? How would I wake the computer then? I would have to open it. So I’m not sure about turning off bluetooth entirely, but waking via bluetooth should be turned off when the laptop is closed without a display attached. There is no use case for waking via bluetooth without a display.
    - Godel_unicode 4y ago
      > There is no use case for There are a ton, computers are incredibly useful devices. If I close the screen I can play music out of those speakers for a pretty long time. And if I can sleep/wake from a Bluetooth keyboard when I’m not using it, I can stretch that into a long weekend. …or at least I can on Windows where this is possible.
rpledge 4y ago
Apples clamshell mode support is super confusing IMHO. This is once thing Windows does better at least by default. Perhaps Macs can be configured to what I expect but I personally have struggled with getting it to work in a way that satisfies me.
- zamnos 4y ago
  For those of us without both in our lives, can you be more specific on the differences that makes Window's system better?
  - SamuelAdams 4y ago
    Sure, so I primarily use Macbook Pro's that companies provide me. I work from home and use USB-C docks to connect the Macs to external displays, keyboards, and networking. In general, Windows 10 computers work on boot in clamshell mode. Drivers load, external USB devices are useful, displays work. On Apple devices, corporations *must* enable FileVault, a full disk encryption utility, to meet some compliance standards. The problem is that Apple really locked this down, even to USB-C docks. My docks use the Display Link driver to load the screens, so as a result I need to physically open the laptop every day, use the laptop keyboard to enter my password, wait for the login process to complete, then close the laptop and connect the dock. It would be very nice if they could allow some drivers to be whitelisted, or even make an "official" apple dock with full FileVault support. I suppose I could use a Mac Studio or Mini, but corporations seem dead set on providing laptops to employees. Other than that I would say Windows generally handles scaling better, but this is an area that the latest OS (Ventura) really improved. Macs today are much better at scaling and switching displays than in the past.
    - zamnos 4y ago
      Thanks for responding. Even if you don't deal with PII datasets, I sure hope your windows laptop is also encrypted at rest. Just fyi, at least on my M1 MacBook, a regular, non-Displaylink (ie HDMI or Display Port connection) doesny require opening the laptop to login, even using an Bluetooth keyboard. I'm sure there's a usb-c hub that's your preferred form factor if you don't like the dongle-style breakout boxes.
mrinterweb 4y ago
It would be great if certain types of bluetooth devices could remain connected. Physical input devices only would likely be a good default. There is little reason, IMO, for speaker connections to be active. In clamshell mode, I would expect all bluetooth connections to be active, but while suspended, please drop nonessential connections. Being able to override the default disconnect rules per device would be ideal.
- tagyro 4y ago
  > There is little reason, IMO, for speaker connections to be active. A few comments down: > @asveikau: I think you should be able to play music while the lid is closed. That seems like a reasonable use case. Also, wouldn't having a different behaviour, based on specific classes of devices, create more confusion for users? Oh, and, all together now: Bluetooth sucks!

That is actually meant to keep the connection to a Bluetooth keyboard/mouse when using the computer in clamshell mode.

by tagyro 4y ago

That is actually meant to keep the connection to a Bluetooth keyboard/mouse when using the computer in clamshell mode.

wyager 4y ago

They don't let me use an HDMI display without external power while closed, so why let me use bluetooth without power?

shortcake27 4y ago
The opposite is also true. You can’t officially use a Macbook in clamshell mode (eg, as a headless media server) even when connected to power. When you close the lid without a connected display, the official MacOS behaviour is to put the computer to sleep. You need a third-party tool to prevent it from sleeping. Yet when my Macbook is asleep in my bag with no peripherals attached, my headphones will connect and wake the Mac. The left hand does not know what the right hand is doing. It literally makes no sense.
- wyager 4y ago
  I think we're agreeing - my point is that it doesn't make sense to allow bluetooth when they won't even allow a display (no power, laptop closed). What are you going to use the bluetooth for, moving a mouse you can't even see?

porbelm 4y ago

...and they could make it so it stays on only of there's an external display connected, but then communication could be disabled by the person who stole your laptop. So Find My would not be able to find and more importantly report a location.

tagyro 4y ago
> ...and they could make it so it stays on only of there's an external display connected Not always, my monitor goes to sleep and turns off. At this point, macOS should turn Bluetooth off? How would I wake the computer then? I would have to open it. > Find My would not be able to find and more importantly report a location. That might be another reason why Bluetooth stays on. On a laptop, I'd rather have Find My working in clamshell mode (given the theft risk).
- Namari 4y ago
  I wonder if there are more people like you or more into turning it off.
  - falcolas 4y ago
    +1 for using a MacBook in clamshell mode most of the time.
  - sethammons 4y ago
    I exclusively use it with the lid closed. However, I use wired everything. I use external speakers, monitor, keyboard, mouse, wacom, and dslr camera for webcam. The only thing wireless is my wifi connection.
- shortcake27 4y ago
  > Not always, my monitor goes to sleep and turns off. At this point, macOS should turn Bluetooth off? How would I wake the computer then? I would have to open it. So I’m not sure about turning off bluetooth entirely, but waking via bluetooth should be turned off when the laptop is closed without a display attached. There is no use case for waking via bluetooth without a display.
  - Godel_unicode 4y ago
    > There is no use case for There are a ton, computers are incredibly useful devices. If I close the screen I can play music out of those speakers for a pretty long time. And if I can sleep/wake from a Bluetooth keyboard when I’m not using it, I can stretch that into a long weekend. …or at least I can on Windows where this is possible.

rpledge 4y ago

Apples clamshell mode support is super confusing IMHO. This is once thing Windows does better at least by default. Perhaps Macs can be configured to what I expect but I personally have struggled with getting it to work in a way that satisfies me.

zamnos 4y ago
For those of us without both in our lives, can you be more specific on the differences that makes Window's system better?
- SamuelAdams 4y ago
  Sure, so I primarily use Macbook Pro's that companies provide me. I work from home and use USB-C docks to connect the Macs to external displays, keyboards, and networking. In general, Windows 10 computers work on boot in clamshell mode. Drivers load, external USB devices are useful, displays work. On Apple devices, corporations *must* enable FileVault, a full disk encryption utility, to meet some compliance standards. The problem is that Apple really locked this down, even to USB-C docks. My docks use the Display Link driver to load the screens, so as a result I need to physically open the laptop every day, use the laptop keyboard to enter my password, wait for the login process to complete, then close the laptop and connect the dock. It would be very nice if they could allow some drivers to be whitelisted, or even make an "official" apple dock with full FileVault support. I suppose I could use a Mac Studio or Mini, but corporations seem dead set on providing laptops to employees. Other than that I would say Windows generally handles scaling better, but this is an area that the latest OS (Ventura) really improved. Macs today are much better at scaling and switching displays than in the past.
  - zamnos 4y ago
    Thanks for responding. Even if you don't deal with PII datasets, I sure hope your windows laptop is also encrypted at rest. Just fyi, at least on my M1 MacBook, a regular, non-Displaylink (ie HDMI or Display Port connection) doesny require opening the laptop to login, even using an Bluetooth keyboard. I'm sure there's a usb-c hub that's your preferred form factor if you don't like the dongle-style breakout boxes.

mrinterweb 4y ago

It would be great if certain types of bluetooth devices could remain connected. Physical input devices only would likely be a good default. There is little reason, IMO, for speaker connections to be active. In clamshell mode, I would expect all bluetooth connections to be active, but while suspended, please drop nonessential connections. Being able to override the default disconnect rules per device would be ideal.

tagyro 4y ago
> There is little reason, IMO, for speaker connections to be active. A few comments down: > @asveikau: I think you should be able to play music while the lid is closed. That seems like a reasonable use case. Also, wouldn't having a different behaviour, based on specific classes of devices, create more confusion for users? Oh, and, all together now: Bluetooth sucks!