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12 years regarding infrastructure is nothing. Just a blip. And you want to significantly increase consumption of electricity, while not building any new power p

12 years regarding infrastructure is nothing. Just a blip. And you want to significantly increase consumption of electricity, while not building any new power plants, nor upgrading grid.

rconti 4y ago
The parent post made absolutely none of the claims you assert they "want".
- TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
  So parent post is not arguing for BEVs?
  - nine_k 4y ago
    For the cost of upgrading EVs to better / cheaper batteries. That is, the ability of a EU citizen to afford an EV car that lasts comparably long with an ICE car. The charging infrastructure is a fun issue, but it's a separate issue.
    - TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
      I would kind of argue, that BEVs without infrastructure are useless.
      - nine_k 4y ago
        This is true, but I don't have an idea how viable are plans to drastically extend it. Large numbers of EVs consuming each 300-300 kW during charging will quickly put the current urban electrical infrastructure to its knees.
  - rconti 4y ago
    | while not building any new power plants, nor upgrading grid. Parent post makes none of the above claims. You're creating a straw-man.
    - TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
      BEVs and infrastructure are connected together. Arguing for BEVs while ignoring infrastructure is being a demagogue
maccard 4y ago
You can be concerned about infrastructure changes but bullish on technology improvements in EVs. This article [0] (apolgoies but I'm in the UK so not familiar with the state in the US) talks about the energy mix in 2010 (13 years ago, so close). Wind power could support up to 5.4 GW in 2010 in the UK, and by various sources itcan now do ~25GW. (Today is a strange day, there's a cold snap and we've fired up backup coal stations for the first time in years.). Grid infrastructure, and consumer interaction with supplier has had enormous changes in that time. In the last 12 months, suppliers have started running schemes where they adjust demand by paying you to reduce usage during peak times [1], introducing day ahead tarriffs [2], and rollig out smart meters which provide usage in 30 minute windows. There are power diverters, and various devices available which hook up to live pricing, and can decide what to do at various points in the day, e.g. divert your solar PV into heating your hot water tank rather than selling it back to the grid. The movement here _is_ slower, but it _is_ happening. [0] https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/875384/Wind_powered_electricity_in_the_UK.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... [1] https://octopus.energy/saving-sessions/ https://octopus.energy/saving-sessions/ [2] https://octopus.energy/help-and-faqs/articles/what-is-a-flexible-tariff/ https://octopus.energy/help-and-faqs/articles/what-is-a-flex... [3]
- TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
  This all looks great on the paper. And then things like this happen: https://theconversation.com/what-europes-exceptionally-low-winds-mean-for-the-future-energy-grid-170135 https://theconversation.com/what-europes-exceptionally-low-w...
  - maccard 4y ago
    The reality of reliance on fossil fuels is https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/consumer/price-diesel-hits-%C2%A32-litre-first-time https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/consumer/price-diesel-hit... and 3.5x hikes in natural gas prices for domestic uses in a year. I do'nt really understand the point you're making. From the article you've shared, > Combining wind with other renewable resources such as solar, hydropower and the ability to smartly manage our electricity demand will be critical at times like this summer when the wind is not blowing. Which is pretty much exactly what is happening. We're wind heavy because it makes sense to be here, but if we were closer to the equator it would make sense to be solar heavy, for example.

12 years regarding infrastructure is nothing. Just a blip. And you want to significantly increase consumption of electricity, while not building any new power plants, nor upgrading grid.

rconti 4y ago

The parent post made absolutely none of the claims you assert they "want".

TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
So parent post is not arguing for BEVs?
- nine_k 4y ago
  For the cost of upgrading EVs to better / cheaper batteries. That is, the ability of a EU citizen to afford an EV car that lasts comparably long with an ICE car. The charging infrastructure is a fun issue, but it's a separate issue.
  - TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
    I would kind of argue, that BEVs without infrastructure are useless.
    - nine_k 4y ago
      This is true, but I don't have an idea how viable are plans to drastically extend it. Large numbers of EVs consuming each 300-300 kW during charging will quickly put the current urban electrical infrastructure to its knees.
- rconti 4y ago
  | while not building any new power plants, nor upgrading grid. Parent post makes none of the above claims. You're creating a straw-man.
  - TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
    BEVs and infrastructure are connected together. Arguing for BEVs while ignoring infrastructure is being a demagogue

maccard 4y ago

You can be concerned about infrastructure changes but bullish on technology improvements in EVs. This article [0] (apolgoies but I'm in the UK so not familiar with the state in the US) talks about the energy mix in 2010 (13 years ago, so close). Wind power could support up to 5.4 GW in 2010 in the UK, and by various sources itcan now do ~25GW. (Today is a strange day, there's a cold snap and we've fired up backup coal stations for the first time in years.). Grid infrastructure, and consumer interaction with supplier has had enormous changes in that time. In the last 12 months, suppliers have started running schemes where they adjust demand by paying you to reduce usage during peak times [1], introducing day ahead tarriffs [2], and rollig out smart meters which provide usage in 30 minute windows. There are power diverters, and various devices available which hook up to live pricing, and can decide what to do at various points in the day, e.g. divert your solar PV into heating your hot water tank rather than selling it back to the grid. The movement here _is_ slower, but it _is_ happening. [0] https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/875384/Wind_powered_electricity_in_the_UK.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... [1] https://octopus.energy/saving-sessions/ https://octopus.energy/saving-sessions/ [2] https://octopus.energy/help-and-faqs/articles/what-is-a-flexible-tariff/ https://octopus.energy/help-and-faqs/articles/what-is-a-flex... [3]

TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
This all looks great on the paper. And then things like this happen: https://theconversation.com/what-europes-exceptionally-low-winds-mean-for-the-future-energy-grid-170135 https://theconversation.com/what-europes-exceptionally-low-w...
- maccard 4y ago
  The reality of reliance on fossil fuels is https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/consumer/price-diesel-hits-%C2%A32-litre-first-time https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/consumer/price-diesel-hit... and 3.5x hikes in natural gas prices for domestic uses in a year. I do'nt really understand the point you're making. From the article you've shared, > Combining wind with other renewable resources such as solar, hydropower and the ability to smartly manage our electricity demand will be critical at times like this summer when the wind is not blowing. Which is pretty much exactly what is happening. We're wind heavy because it makes sense to be here, but if we were closer to the equator it would make sense to be solar heavy, for example.