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None of that excuses the CCP's hypocrisy ignoring Ukraine's territorial integrity, simply because they want to support Russia. I'm willing to say that the US wa

None of that excuses the CCP's hypocrisy ignoring Ukraine's territorial integrity, simply because they want to support Russia. I'm willing to say that the US was dead wrong in some (not all) of those situations. Are you willing to say it is wrong for China to support Russia violating Ukraine's territorial integrity, and that they should condemn Russia without delay?

yogthos 4y ago
US has never been on the right side of history in the past half a century, and US is sure as hell not on the right side of history trying to start a war with China right now. Why should China side with US over Ukraine's territorial integrity as US violates Chinese territorial integrity? Furthermore, your entire position is incoherent here. Seems like when it comes to Taiwan you are supporting separatism, while when it comes to Ukraine you're supporting territorial integrity. Perhaps try and pick a lane first?
- infamia 4y ago
  > Why should China side with US over Ukraine's territorial integrity as US violates Chinese territorial integrity? I'm asking you and the CCP to stand for Ukraine's territorial integrity and to rebuke Russia. If territorial integrity and international norms are to be respected, shouldn't you and the CCP do that because it is the morale and consistent thing to do? A code of morality is not dependent on what others do, so talking about the US is a red herring. > Furthermore, your entire position is incoherent here. Seems like when it comes to Taiwan you are supporting separatism, I wish for the status quo and peace between China and Taiwan for as long as is practically possible. I think that major figures like Pelosi and others visiting Taiwan is pointlessly provocative and idiotic. On the other hand, Xi and the CCP constantly yelling at everyone to respect what China's territorial integrity, while condoning Putin's invasion is irreconcilable, competely devoid of morality, and oozes the worst kind of cynicism. It is detestable and you should repudiate it without delay.
  - yogthos 4y ago
    First, you might not be aware of this, but vast majority of the world takes a contrary position to the west on the war in Ukraine: https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-rest-global-public-opinion-one-year-into-russias-war-on-ukraine/ https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-res... https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02/27/the-global-south-refuses-pressure-to-side-with-the-west-on-russia/ https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02/27/the-global-south-ref... https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the-ukraine-war-viewed-from-the-global-south/ https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the... https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/02/23/world/russia-ukraine-geopolitics.html https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com... https://archive.ph/4kbWG https://archive.ph/4kbWG Second, China released a position paper where they make their position on Ukraine pretty clear. I encourage you to read it https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t20230224_11030713.html https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t2023022... >I wish for the status quo and peace between China and Taiwan for as long as is practically possible. Literally the only reason there is tension is because US is interfering in internal affairs of a country half way across the world from it. Finally, what Russia is doing in Ukraine is literally modelled on what US and NATO did in Yugoslavia. Following the exact same rationale. NATO recognized the independence of the separatist regions and then had them invite NATO to assist them militarily. This is precisely what Russia did. NATO literally established the precedent here.
    - infamia 4y ago
      > NATO recognized the independence of the separatist regions and then had them invite NATO to assist them militarily. This is precisely what Russia did. NATO literally established the precedent here. How is that remotely comparable when there were zero the separatists movements in the Kherson and Zaphorizia Oblasts before Russia invaded those regions? Yet Russia declared them independent anyhow, and then annexed four Oblasts, which was Russia's original goal in the first place. Will you condemn Russia for all that? If not, we have nothing left to discuss.
      - yogthos 4y ago

yogthos 4y ago

US has never been on the right side of history in the past half a century, and US is sure as hell not on the right side of history trying to start a war with China right now. Why should China side with US over Ukraine's territorial integrity as US violates Chinese territorial integrity? Furthermore, your entire position is incoherent here. Seems like when it comes to Taiwan you are supporting separatism, while when it comes to Ukraine you're supporting territorial integrity. Perhaps try and pick a lane first?

infamia 4y ago
> Why should China side with US over Ukraine's territorial integrity as US violates Chinese territorial integrity? I'm asking you and the CCP to stand for Ukraine's territorial integrity and to rebuke Russia. If territorial integrity and international norms are to be respected, shouldn't you and the CCP do that because it is the morale and consistent thing to do? A code of morality is not dependent on what others do, so talking about the US is a red herring. > Furthermore, your entire position is incoherent here. Seems like when it comes to Taiwan you are supporting separatism, I wish for the status quo and peace between China and Taiwan for as long as is practically possible. I think that major figures like Pelosi and others visiting Taiwan is pointlessly provocative and idiotic. On the other hand, Xi and the CCP constantly yelling at everyone to respect what China's territorial integrity, while condoning Putin's invasion is irreconcilable, competely devoid of morality, and oozes the worst kind of cynicism. It is detestable and you should repudiate it without delay.
- yogthos 4y ago
  First, you might not be aware of this, but vast majority of the world takes a contrary position to the west on the war in Ukraine: https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-rest-global-public-opinion-one-year-into-russias-war-on-ukraine/ https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-res... https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02/27/the-global-south-refuses-pressure-to-side-with-the-west-on-russia/ https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02/27/the-global-south-ref... https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the-ukraine-war-viewed-from-the-global-south/ https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the... https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/02/23/world/russia-ukraine-geopolitics.html https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com... https://archive.ph/4kbWG https://archive.ph/4kbWG Second, China released a position paper where they make their position on Ukraine pretty clear. I encourage you to read it https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t20230224_11030713.html https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t2023022... >I wish for the status quo and peace between China and Taiwan for as long as is practically possible. Literally the only reason there is tension is because US is interfering in internal affairs of a country half way across the world from it. Finally, what Russia is doing in Ukraine is literally modelled on what US and NATO did in Yugoslavia. Following the exact same rationale. NATO recognized the independence of the separatist regions and then had them invite NATO to assist them militarily. This is precisely what Russia did. NATO literally established the precedent here.
  - infamia 4y ago
    > NATO recognized the independence of the separatist regions and then had them invite NATO to assist them militarily. This is precisely what Russia did. NATO literally established the precedent here. How is that remotely comparable when there were zero the separatists movements in the Kherson and Zaphorizia Oblasts before Russia invaded those regions? Yet Russia declared them independent anyhow, and then annexed four Oblasts, which was Russia's original goal in the first place. Will you condemn Russia for all that? If not, we have nothing left to discuss.
    - yogthos 4y ago