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I get what the author is saying, but it still feels like it devalues tech skills. There's some weird vibe the past few years where programming is mostly seen a

I get what the author is saying, but it still feels like it devalues tech skills. There's some weird vibe the past few years where programming is mostly seen as a stepping stone to get to the things that really matter, be that Creating Business Value, funding, more money, career success, VC attention, GitHub stars. (Note how they're all extrinsic measures.) It's like caring about the act of programming is seen as vulgar. The trope of siloed programmers is real, but the rest of us continue to suffer unduly for the fact that a few devs choose to remain unengaged with the larger context of their work.

tristor 4y ago
I get what you're saying, and I've observed this too. I think there is a divide that few people consciously point out, which is there is a difference between programming as an artform and programming as a career. From a career perspective, all of those things matter, as an artform they're likely not important at all. It's not that caring about programming is vulgar, it's that most people are focused on career so the majority of the conversation is optimized around the metrics that matter for careerist goals.
- mattgreenrocks 4y ago
  Yeah for sure. I like both sides, which means I can either talk to everyone or I care too much/about the wrong things. :)
- tensor 4y ago
  I agree that there is nothing wrong with programming as an art. I enjoy things like the old demo scene, or writing the shortest code, or other forms of programming feats, even elegant designs or proofs. But when I'm building a product and hiring people, I absolutely do not care about those things. I'm hiring an engineer not an artist. If you want to do art in your spare time great, but on the job I want people to care only about building an easily maintained, bug free, performant application that satisfies the users needs. It doesn't have to use the best tech, it doesn't even need to have elegant code, just easily understood, fast, and bug free code. If developers separate code as art from code as a job I think they would be much happier. I know I made that transition many many years ago and am much happier for it. I still appreciate code as art, but in it's place.
tstrimple 4y ago
If you value tech skills and want to get certain standards implemented, you need to be able to navigate the people side of things to get agreement. If you strongly believe a certain tool should be used to solve a particular problem, your success in getting that tool selected is directly proportional to your relationships and ability to navigate in the circle of folk who can get that accomplished. If you want your new architecture implemented, you have to know how to sell it up the chain of command. It's not that the tech doesn't matter. Far from it. But those ideas have to be sold in a context that other stakeholders can understand. If you want to have that level of influence on your career so that you're not suffering unduly, you need to put yourself into a position to influence organizational level decisions. Otherwise the decisions will be made by the people who can navigate those circles regardless of their technical ability.

tristor 4y ago

I get what you're saying, and I've observed this too. I think there is a divide that few people consciously point out, which is there is a difference between programming as an artform and programming as a career. From a career perspective, all of those things matter, as an artform they're likely not important at all. It's not that caring about programming is vulgar, it's that most people are focused on career so the majority of the conversation is optimized around the metrics that matter for careerist goals.

mattgreenrocks 4y ago
Yeah for sure. I like both sides, which means I can either talk to everyone or I care too much/about the wrong things. :)
tensor 4y ago
I agree that there is nothing wrong with programming as an art. I enjoy things like the old demo scene, or writing the shortest code, or other forms of programming feats, even elegant designs or proofs. But when I'm building a product and hiring people, I absolutely do not care about those things. I'm hiring an engineer not an artist. If you want to do art in your spare time great, but on the job I want people to care only about building an easily maintained, bug free, performant application that satisfies the users needs. It doesn't have to use the best tech, it doesn't even need to have elegant code, just easily understood, fast, and bug free code. If developers separate code as art from code as a job I think they would be much happier. I know I made that transition many many years ago and am much happier for it. I still appreciate code as art, but in it's place.

tstrimple 4y ago

If you value tech skills and want to get certain standards implemented, you need to be able to navigate the people side of things to get agreement. If you strongly believe a certain tool should be used to solve a particular problem, your success in getting that tool selected is directly proportional to your relationships and ability to navigate in the circle of folk who can get that accomplished. If you want your new architecture implemented, you have to know how to sell it up the chain of command. It's not that the tech doesn't matter. Far from it. But those ideas have to be sold in a context that other stakeholders can understand. If you want to have that level of influence on your career so that you're not suffering unduly, you need to put yourself into a position to influence organizational level decisions. Otherwise the decisions will be made by the people who can navigate those circles regardless of their technical ability.