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Yeah this was bad. The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client…for a single player game. I’m sure

Yeah this was bad. The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client…for a single player game. I’m sure the development team knew everybody was going to hate that so it couldn’t have been a surprise.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
toyg 4y ago
> for a single player game But that's the problem: it was really a multiplayer game, sold to a crowd who wanted a predominantly single-player experience. So users were effectively angry from day 1 simply because they were being sold something they didn't want; the fact that this also precluded them from salvaging a bit of entertainment from it (since you'd be booted out even if you had little or no intention to ever interact with other players), was a further slap in the face.
josefx 4y ago
> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers While that was the marketing line "simulation so complex it can't run on your PC", I remember there being an offline crack shortly after release and later one of the official patches even enabled it officially.
- delusional 4y ago
  Yeah, the part that were simulated online was the trade between the cities, a task so trivial it demanded nothing of the servers. The server side simulation was a joke. It was mostly an excuse for why the game performed poorly and the cities were so small.
  - antifa 4y ago
    Yeah there was basically no evidence that the game did anything more intense than the original SimCity (1989) but they loved claiming otherwise.
jcranmer 4y ago
> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client…for a single player game. As I understand it, this wasn't the case, and the claims that it was were primarily bullshit to justify requiring always-online access for DRM purposes.
paavohtl 4y ago
Ah, that's the interesting bit: the actual simulation was 100% local. Networking was actually only required for region play, and I don't think it even communicates in real-time; just occasionally syncs certain variables between cities. The always online requirement was just a form of DRM, and wasn't actually necessary for the game. EA even patched in an official offline mode in 2014.
- chimeracoder 4y ago
  > Ah, that's the interesting bit: the actual simulation was 100% local. Networking was actually only required for region play, and I don't think it even communicates in real-time; just occasionally syncs certain variables between cities. I think you're right, but the misconception comes from the fact that EA actively played up the fact that they were doing work "in the cloud", to make it seem more powerful and advanced of a simulation (and to justify their reliance on the always-on network DRM).
- JKCalhoun 4y ago
  > The always online requirement was just a form of DRM We can only hope that every app/game that adopts this policy dies an excruciating financial death.
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    I’m not necessarily morally opposed to always-online DRM (I mean it is their game, they can do what they want), but it is a strong signal that they are not afraid to make technical decisions that they know people will hate in the interest of monetization. Bad sign!
    - ThunderSizzle 4y ago
      Considering they can't even keep MLS operating for older games, always-online DRM is basically a guaranteed the game won't work within 3-10 years when the company decides to turn off the server. Based on many company's record with this, it's basically a guarantee that they won't patch the game to bypass the DRM check (or make the MLS modifyable and/or default to a fan-supported MLS). In that case, I do find it morally objective to say the person is "buying" a game. If anything, they're renting the game.
anonymousab 4y ago
Most of the game worked perfectly fine offline with a minor hack released shortly after the game came out. There were some game journalists muddying the waters with some assumptions about it back then, which can make it difficult to get an accurate retroactive historical context today.
- mynameisvlad 4y ago
  I wouldn’t call them assumptions. They were PR spiels provided by EA and regurgitated without checking.
morsch 4y ago
the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client I remember that's what they said, but I doubt it was ever the case. Wikipedia says the cloud functionality "enable[d] cloud saves and multiplayer functionality", and shortly after launch it was determined you could patch the game to run offline for an indeterminate length of time. To me, it was pretty obvious back then that it was purely an attempt at copy protection. Beyond that, the game was just bad. The simulation just didn't live up to the hype, and while it did have a lot to live up to given its fantastic predecessor, SimCity 4 was old by then, and people expected a big upgrade. Specifically, I remember "sims not living persistent lives but rather going to the nearest available workplace for work and nearest available house after work" (Wikipedia again) as being a huge deal in the community back then. And then there was the limited play area, which was just ridiculous when you consider what people want from these games.
nottorp 4y ago
> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers That was bullcrap. Soon after launch a crack showed up that made the game playable without a server connection, for the features that didn't actually need a server connection. EA just lied. Not to mention that they made an official patch available 1 year after launch that enabled a proper offline mode :) https://www.eurogamer.net/simcity-can-now-be-played-offline https://www.eurogamer.net/simcity-can-now-be-played-offline As for this interview, I guess mr lead designer isn't allowed to be honest by his contract.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

toyg 4y ago

> for a single player game But that's the problem: it was really a multiplayer game, sold to a crowd who wanted a predominantly single-player experience. So users were effectively angry from day 1 simply because they were being sold something they didn't want; the fact that this also precluded them from salvaging a bit of entertainment from it (since you'd be booted out even if you had little or no intention to ever interact with other players), was a further slap in the face.

josefx 4y ago

> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers While that was the marketing line "simulation so complex it can't run on your PC", I remember there being an offline crack shortly after release and later one of the official patches even enabled it officially.

delusional 4y ago
Yeah, the part that were simulated online was the trade between the cities, a task so trivial it demanded nothing of the servers. The server side simulation was a joke. It was mostly an excuse for why the game performed poorly and the cities were so small.
- antifa 4y ago
  Yeah there was basically no evidence that the game did anything more intense than the original SimCity (1989) but they loved claiming otherwise.

jcranmer 4y ago

> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client…for a single player game. As I understand it, this wasn't the case, and the claims that it was were primarily bullshit to justify requiring always-online access for DRM purposes.

paavohtl 4y ago

Ah, that's the interesting bit: the actual simulation was 100% local. Networking was actually only required for region play, and I don't think it even communicates in real-time; just occasionally syncs certain variables between cities. The always online requirement was just a form of DRM, and wasn't actually necessary for the game. EA even patched in an official offline mode in 2014.

chimeracoder 4y ago
> Ah, that's the interesting bit: the actual simulation was 100% local. Networking was actually only required for region play, and I don't think it even communicates in real-time; just occasionally syncs certain variables between cities. I think you're right, but the misconception comes from the fact that EA actively played up the fact that they were doing work "in the cloud", to make it seem more powerful and advanced of a simulation (and to justify their reliance on the always-on network DRM).
JKCalhoun 4y ago
> The always online requirement was just a form of DRM We can only hope that every app/game that adopts this policy dies an excruciating financial death.
- bee_rider 4y ago
  I’m not necessarily morally opposed to always-online DRM (I mean it is their game, they can do what they want), but it is a strong signal that they are not afraid to make technical decisions that they know people will hate in the interest of monetization. Bad sign!
  - ThunderSizzle 4y ago
    Considering they can't even keep MLS operating for older games, always-online DRM is basically a guaranteed the game won't work within 3-10 years when the company decides to turn off the server. Based on many company's record with this, it's basically a guarantee that they won't patch the game to bypass the DRM check (or make the MLS modifyable and/or default to a fan-supported MLS). In that case, I do find it morally objective to say the person is "buying" a game. If anything, they're renting the game.

anonymousab 4y ago

Most of the game worked perfectly fine offline with a minor hack released shortly after the game came out. There were some game journalists muddying the waters with some assumptions about it back then, which can make it difficult to get an accurate retroactive historical context today.

mynameisvlad 4y ago
I wouldn’t call them assumptions. They were PR spiels provided by EA and regurgitated without checking.

morsch 4y ago

the actual simulation was being done on the servers, rather than on the client I remember that's what they said, but I doubt it was ever the case. Wikipedia says the cloud functionality "enable[d] cloud saves and multiplayer functionality", and shortly after launch it was determined you could patch the game to run offline for an indeterminate length of time. To me, it was pretty obvious back then that it was purely an attempt at copy protection. Beyond that, the game was just bad. The simulation just didn't live up to the hype, and while it did have a lot to live up to given its fantastic predecessor, SimCity 4 was old by then, and people expected a big upgrade. Specifically, I remember "sims not living persistent lives but rather going to the nearest available workplace for work and nearest available house after work" (Wikipedia again) as being a huge deal in the community back then. And then there was the limited play area, which was just ridiculous when you consider what people want from these games.

nottorp 4y ago

> The main problem was that the actual simulation was being done on the servers That was bullcrap. Soon after launch a crack showed up that made the game playable without a server connection, for the features that didn't actually need a server connection. EA just lied. Not to mention that they made an official patch available 1 year after launch that enabled a proper offline mode :) https://www.eurogamer.net/simcity-can-now-be-played-offline https://www.eurogamer.net/simcity-can-now-be-played-offline As for this interview, I guess mr lead designer isn't allowed to be honest by his contract.