11 ms·

My wife had a saying that applied to almost all of this kind of thing: Designed by a man!

by kwhitefoot 4y ago

dudul 4y ago
And yet, I bet women were pretty happy when men created the dishwasher.
- nielsole 4y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephine_Cochrane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephine_Cochrane
  - dudul 4y ago
    That's an evolution of what was invented by Joel Houghton.
    - Chris2048 4y ago
      Not sure if it was directly inspired by Houghton's, but it was the first to be commercially successful. However it seems those early dishwashers where pretty different to modern ones, least of all not being automatic: https://www.homestratosphere.com/dishwasher-history/ https://www.homestratosphere.com/dishwasher-history/
    - t-writescode 4y ago
      To be clear, your response to someone calling you out was to ... double-down on your sexism by being pedantic?
    - capableweb 4y ago
      In case you weren't aware: > The first mechanical dishwashing device was registered for a patent in 1850 in the United States by Joel Houghton > The device was both slow and unreliable. > Another patent was granted to L.A. Alexander in 1865 > Neither device was practical or widely accepted. And finally > The most successful of the hand-powered dishwashers was invented in 1886 by Josephine Cochrane together with mechanic George Butters (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dishwasher#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dishwasher#History) So yeah, all three invented the dishwasher it seems, but thanks to Josephine Cochrane (and Butters), we actually have a working and reliable dishwasher, something Joel Houghton was unable to build. You're all right, in your own way.
- paavope 4y ago
  One can be happy that something exists while at the same time lamenting that the design isn’t ideal (Edit: though incidentally, it turns out that the inventor of the dishwasher — or at least one of the earliest working designs — was a woman, as the sibling post pointed out; didn’t know that)
  - dudul 4y ago
    And one can criticize a design without making generalized stereotyped assumptions about the gender of the designer.
MattPalmer1086 4y ago
Hopefully we will eventually arrive at a place where it could have been designed by a woman!
the_third_wave 4y ago
Good for your wife and I hope you have some snappy retort. Then, again... Imagine if someone here said something similar about some dysfunctional piece of equipment: Designed by a woman! Either both of these made-in-jest sayings should be accepted - which is fine by me - or neither of them. Have a look at the way men are portrayed in commercials to see how far this imbalance has gone: Men are smelly badly-dressed clumsy idiots who would not make it far in the world were it not for all those smart women who... [1]. So, ladies, what's it gonna be? Free for all like it used to be with women making fun of men and men making fun of women or shall we have this boring speech-policed culture where each word has to be weighed and approved by the experts? [1] ...fall in the trap of buying useless products?
- kwhitefoot 4y ago
  You are over-thinking this. My wife's remark was almost invariably directed at goods and machines that were either aimed specifically at women or roles where women are overrepresented or at things the design of which clearly had not involved thinking that women would use them. One classic example of the latter is car seatbelts and other safety features of cars. Examples of the former abound in the kitchen which in most families is still the domain of the woman of the house; for instance packaging that cannot be opened unless one's fingernails are clipped short.
  - wrycoder 4y ago
    My wife just hauls out her sling blade.
  - klipt 4y ago
    It's still casual sexism though, because being bad at market research and design isn't an integral feature of being a man. It's like if you said Theranos failed "because it was led by a woman". Which is not to say your wife is an awful person or anything, casual sexism is common and often goes unrecognized. But it's good to call it out when you do see it.
    - yunwal 4y ago
bongoman37 4y ago
I know people in the Bosch product design team, there are certainly women there.

My wife had a saying that applied to almost all of this kind of thing: Designed by a man!

dudul 4y ago

And yet, I bet women were pretty happy when men created the dishwasher.

nielsole 4y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephine_Cochrane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephine_Cochrane
- dudul 4y ago
  That's an evolution of what was invented by Joel Houghton.
  - Chris2048 4y ago
    Not sure if it was directly inspired by Houghton's, but it was the first to be commercially successful. However it seems those early dishwashers where pretty different to modern ones, least of all not being automatic: https://www.homestratosphere.com/dishwasher-history/ https://www.homestratosphere.com/dishwasher-history/
  - t-writescode 4y ago
    To be clear, your response to someone calling you out was to ... double-down on your sexism by being pedantic?
  - capableweb 4y ago
    In case you weren't aware: > The first mechanical dishwashing device was registered for a patent in 1850 in the United States by Joel Houghton > The device was both slow and unreliable. > Another patent was granted to L.A. Alexander in 1865 > Neither device was practical or widely accepted. And finally > The most successful of the hand-powered dishwashers was invented in 1886 by Josephine Cochrane together with mechanic George Butters (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dishwasher#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dishwasher#History) So yeah, all three invented the dishwasher it seems, but thanks to Josephine Cochrane (and Butters), we actually have a working and reliable dishwasher, something Joel Houghton was unable to build. You're all right, in your own way.
paavope 4y ago
One can be happy that something exists while at the same time lamenting that the design isn’t ideal (Edit: though incidentally, it turns out that the inventor of the dishwasher — or at least one of the earliest working designs — was a woman, as the sibling post pointed out; didn’t know that)
- dudul 4y ago
  And one can criticize a design without making generalized stereotyped assumptions about the gender of the designer.

MattPalmer1086 4y ago

Hopefully we will eventually arrive at a place where it could have been designed by a woman!

the_third_wave 4y ago

Good for your wife and I hope you have some snappy retort. Then, again... Imagine if someone here said something similar about some dysfunctional piece of equipment: Designed by a woman! Either both of these made-in-jest sayings should be accepted - which is fine by me - or neither of them. Have a look at the way men are portrayed in commercials to see how far this imbalance has gone: Men are smelly badly-dressed clumsy idiots who would not make it far in the world were it not for all those smart women who... [1]. So, ladies, what's it gonna be? Free for all like it used to be with women making fun of men and men making fun of women or shall we have this boring speech-policed culture where each word has to be weighed and approved by the experts? [1] ...fall in the trap of buying useless products?

kwhitefoot 4y ago
You are over-thinking this. My wife's remark was almost invariably directed at goods and machines that were either aimed specifically at women or roles where women are overrepresented or at things the design of which clearly had not involved thinking that women would use them. One classic example of the latter is car seatbelts and other safety features of cars. Examples of the former abound in the kitchen which in most families is still the domain of the woman of the house; for instance packaging that cannot be opened unless one's fingernails are clipped short.
- wrycoder 4y ago
  My wife just hauls out her sling blade.
- klipt 4y ago
  It's still casual sexism though, because being bad at market research and design isn't an integral feature of being a man. It's like if you said Theranos failed "because it was led by a woman". Which is not to say your wife is an awful person or anything, casual sexism is common and often goes unrecognized. But it's good to call it out when you do see it.
  - yunwal 4y ago

bongoman37 4y ago

I know people in the Bosch product design team, there are certainly women there.