4 ms·

Apple’s Human Interface Guidelines are a wonderful set of documents. Apple doesn’t always live up to them and sometimes egregiously violates them, but I take a

by fwlr 4y ago

Apple’s Human Interface Guidelines are a wonderful set of documents. Apple doesn’t always live up to them and sometimes egregiously violates them, but I take a Stephensonian view of this hypocrisy (“That we occasionally violate our own stated moral code … does not imply that we are insincere in espousing that code. … No one ever said that it was easy to hew to a strict code of conduct”). I prefer that the document exists and they fail to live up to it, rather than the document be changed to reflect how they do operate.

psychoslave 4y ago
>That we occasionally violate our own stated moral code … does not imply that we are insincere in espousing that code. … No one ever said that it was easy to hew to a strict code of conduct Interesting point. I think the statement miss an important additional point: it’s hard to come upfront with a rule set that is reality proof. More than the rules, what matter is why the rules was first uttered. To my mind, provided you agree with the underlying spirit, it’s better to break the exact rule and keep its purpose guidance in mind than strictly and blindly apply the literal interpretation of the rule and sap its genius.
Narishma 4y ago
Microsoft's UI guidelines were good too in the Windows 95-98 era before they went downhill. Their problem was that they didn't follow them in their own major applications like Office.
swyx 4y ago
who is the Stephenson whom you are quoting here and what was his context?
- airstrike 4y ago
  The one and only Neal Stephenson in The Diamond Age https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/119463-that-we-occasionally-violate-our-own-stated-moral-code-does https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/119463-that-we-occasionally...
Version467 4y ago
I remember when I got my first Mac (right around the time Snow Leopard got released) and all the programs looked and felt so consistent. Not just those made by apple, but also third party applications downloaded from some random corner of the internet. What really blew me away (and still does) is that apple somehow got people to care about their Human Interface Guidelines. At the time this was an entirely foreign concept to me. All the windows applications I used had very inconsistent behaviour, even though all the ui elements came from the same native toolkit. There wasn't even an App Store or a centralised repository to enforce this, and yet people thought it important to adhere to those guidelines. I think this is the reason why even today iOS apps feel like they have a slight advantage in quality. All of this comes with significant disadvantages, but there are upsides that are seemingly impossible to achieve otherwise.
- HL33tibCe7 4y ago
  Exactly, the Mac/iOS UX is coherent on a level that nothing else even comes close to. It’s a great example of doing many small things correctly, and the experience overall coming together as a result. Going back to using Windows or Android afterwards is painful. (Windows especially now that they insult their users with advertisements within their operating system by default, something Apple would never do in a million years).
  - super256 4y ago
    The settings app on iOS is full with prompts to subscribe to iCloud and appletv (even showing you a red alert, which makes it looks like there is something wrong with your phone). They only go away if you subscribe. I still get the prompt for 1 year free appletv, although I already used that. When I click on it gets stuck on an infinite loading screen. Oh, and apple care prompts on new phones until your device is not eligible for that anymore.
    - nicce 4y ago
      They are first-party ads linked directly to the services you are already using at some level. Microsoft distributes third-party ads.

by fwlr 4y ago

psychoslave 4y ago

>That we occasionally violate our own stated moral code … does not imply that we are insincere in espousing that code. … No one ever said that it was easy to hew to a strict code of conduct Interesting point. I think the statement miss an important additional point: it’s hard to come upfront with a rule set that is reality proof. More than the rules, what matter is why the rules was first uttered. To my mind, provided you agree with the underlying spirit, it’s better to break the exact rule and keep its purpose guidance in mind than strictly and blindly apply the literal interpretation of the rule and sap its genius.

Narishma 4y ago

Microsoft's UI guidelines were good too in the Windows 95-98 era before they went downhill. Their problem was that they didn't follow them in their own major applications like Office.

swyx 4y ago

who is the Stephenson whom you are quoting here and what was his context?

airstrike 4y ago
The one and only Neal Stephenson in The Diamond Age https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/119463-that-we-occasionally-violate-our-own-stated-moral-code-does https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/119463-that-we-occasionally...

Version467 4y ago

I remember when I got my first Mac (right around the time Snow Leopard got released) and all the programs looked and felt so consistent. Not just those made by apple, but also third party applications downloaded from some random corner of the internet. What really blew me away (and still does) is that apple somehow got people to care about their Human Interface Guidelines. At the time this was an entirely foreign concept to me. All the windows applications I used had very inconsistent behaviour, even though all the ui elements came from the same native toolkit. There wasn't even an App Store or a centralised repository to enforce this, and yet people thought it important to adhere to those guidelines. I think this is the reason why even today iOS apps feel like they have a slight advantage in quality. All of this comes with significant disadvantages, but there are upsides that are seemingly impossible to achieve otherwise.

HL33tibCe7 4y ago
Exactly, the Mac/iOS UX is coherent on a level that nothing else even comes close to. It’s a great example of doing many small things correctly, and the experience overall coming together as a result. Going back to using Windows or Android afterwards is painful. (Windows especially now that they insult their users with advertisements within their operating system by default, something Apple would never do in a million years).
- super256 4y ago
  The settings app on iOS is full with prompts to subscribe to iCloud and appletv (even showing you a red alert, which makes it looks like there is something wrong with your phone). They only go away if you subscribe. I still get the prompt for 1 year free appletv, although I already used that. When I click on it gets stuck on an infinite loading screen. Oh, and apple care prompts on new phones until your device is not eligible for that anymore.
  - nicce 4y ago
    They are first-party ads linked directly to the services you are already using at some level. Microsoft distributes third-party ads.