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Anecdote, I also had a container app fail, from a trusted provider that I assumed weighsy have plenty of testing in place, but maybe it was too synthetic. Sona

Anecdote, I also had a container app fail, from a trusted provider that I assumed weighsy have plenty of testing in place, but maybe it was too synthetic. Sonarr from LinuxServer.io briefly changed to a dev build and boned the DB before switching back to a stable build.

KronisLV 4y ago
You know, I thought that I'd actually provide a bit more information about my experiences as well, because while these are anecdotes, they are still something that happened and shouldn't be entirely ignored. These things do happen, sometimes because of the architecture and what's inside of the container in question. For example, that was largely the case with the GitLab Omnibus containers, because of them containing lots of dependencies, or the same with OpenProject. GitLab: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/gitlab-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/gitlab-upda... OpenProject: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/openproject-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/openproject... (I still think that both are good software, but not without their pain points, like updates in this case) Then again, even something like Nextcloud or comparatively simpler systems like Grav still run into issues with upgrades, sometimes because going across major versions is too much, other times because the containers have vendor dependencies in volumes/bind mounts, which cause a plethora of issues. Nextcloud: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/nextcloud-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/nextcloud-i... Grav: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/grav-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/grav-is-bro... But it's a little bit odd when ever the operating systems we use have similar issues. Like that mention of a Debian update breaking GRUB prevented the server from booting altogether and that other time the exim4 package getting launched prevented my mail server from starting because of the port being bound. Debian breaking GRUB: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-and-grub-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-and-... Debian launching exim4: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-upda... Other times you get problems with upgrading across libraries, or language runtime versions, which I didn't mention in the original post, but which is no less of an issue. It's even harder than just regular package or software updates, because sometimes it might necessitate a major rewrite. Example of Java 8 to Java 11: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/upgrading-java-8-to-11-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/upgrading-j... That said, I'm not sure how good the idea of documenting every software breakage out there is, because the folder with screenshots and information about things that went wrong just seems to be getting longer and longer for me. But hey, maybe it will serve as an insight into what things were around 2020s some day, when hopefully we've figured out how to upgrade software more safely.

KronisLV 4y ago

You know, I thought that I'd actually provide a bit more information about my experiences as well, because while these are anecdotes, they are still something that happened and shouldn't be entirely ignored. These things do happen, sometimes because of the architecture and what's inside of the container in question. For example, that was largely the case with the GitLab Omnibus containers, because of them containing lots of dependencies, or the same with OpenProject. GitLab: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/gitlab-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/gitlab-upda... OpenProject: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/openproject-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/openproject... (I still think that both are good software, but not without their pain points, like updates in this case) Then again, even something like Nextcloud or comparatively simpler systems like Grav still run into issues with upgrades, sometimes because going across major versions is too much, other times because the containers have vendor dependencies in volumes/bind mounts, which cause a plethora of issues. Nextcloud: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/nextcloud-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/nextcloud-i... Grav: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/grav-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/grav-is-bro... But it's a little bit odd when ever the operating systems we use have similar issues. Like that mention of a Debian update breaking GRUB prevented the server from booting altogether and that other time the exim4 package getting launched prevented my mail server from starting because of the port being bound. Debian breaking GRUB: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-and-grub-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-and-... Debian launching exim4: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-updates-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/debian-upda... Other times you get problems with upgrading across libraries, or language runtime versions, which I didn't mention in the original post, but which is no less of an issue. It's even harder than just regular package or software updates, because sometimes it might necessitate a major rewrite. Example of Java 8 to Java 11: https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/upgrading-java-8-to-11-is-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/upgrading-j... That said, I'm not sure how good the idea of documenting every software breakage out there is, because the folder with screenshots and information about things that went wrong just seems to be getting longer and longer for me. But hey, maybe it will serve as an insight into what things were around 2020s some day, when hopefully we've figured out how to upgrade software more safely.