4 ms·

Don't move there. It's a hellhole and the cost of living isn't worth it. Look at Austin, Denver, Atlanta, or Chicago instead. You don't need a 1,000 startups a

by smt88 4y ago

Don't move there. It's a hellhole and the cost of living isn't worth it. Look at Austin, Denver, Atlanta, or Chicago instead. You don't need a 1,000 startups around you when you'll only ever interact with a few dozen.

PaulHoule 4y ago
I like the startup scene in NYC myself. Also, like Randy Newman, I love L.A. I think it is a much more “normal” place that the bay area.
hifromLA 4y ago
[flagged]
- smt88 4y ago
  It has a level of homelessness and drug use that has shocked every American I've known who has visited in the last 5 years. It is on another level.
  - hifromLA 4y ago
    You say that as if it’s some big revelation. Everyone knows this by now, but I’m pushing back on the idea that the entire 7x7 is like this. It’s simply not. Could you tell me with a straight face that the Richmond is a hellhole? The sunset? The marina? Noe? Glen park? pac heights? Bernal? There’s a degree of nuance that is missing from the conversation. That is my point.
    - smt88 4y ago
      This 25 year old isn't moving to The Marina or Glen Park, some of the most expensive neighborhoods in the world. He's probably priced out of most of Oakland. Even young people who can afford to live in pleasant parts of SF will be miserable because they'll be surrounded by rich, entitled tech people in their 40s+, not down-to-earth 20-somethings.
screwturner68 4y ago
Of all the "cites" you named Chicago is the most affordable and an actual city. Te big difference is the tech scene isn't nuts like in SV, Austin, etc the money is a lot smaller and the expectations are a lot higher -companies that don't make money aren't funded very long. That said Chicago is ranked the #9 city in North America and # 19 in the world for Startups and as I said compared to other startups in other cities our startups tend to make money. Having been in IT in some capacity for the last 35 years I'd say the IT scene in Chicago is strange and lagging behind other cities for reasons I just can't understand but if I was 24 and from a small town looking for city life Chicago is where I'd want to be- NYC is a close second and it would be number one if the housing was cheaper.
iancmceachern 4y ago
I live in SF, and am from Denver and couldn't disagree more. The tech culture here is second to none, people still come from all over the world to work and study here. Myndvice to OP is to come to SF, get plugged into the tech and startup culture while your still young and can leverage that community and the empowerment that comes with it for the rest of their lives.
- smt88 4y ago
  You can do those things in other cities too. You don't need to pay $6,000/mo in rent and step over human shit every day to succeed in tech. My net worth is higher than my peers in SF even though I've earned less than them, and it's because the cost of living is out of control. It's not worth the marginal career benefit.
  - iancmceachern 4y ago
    I pay $3200 for rent in a great location, a very nice loft. Your right, you don't. You also don't need to go to MiT to succeed in tech - but it really helps.
    - smt88 4y ago
      I pay $2,800 for a 3,200 sqft house in a safe, walkable, quiet neighborhood near downtown with better weather than SF. I'm not saying you can't have a good life in SF, but it's much more common to have a terrible life, and the (small) career opportunities aren't worth. I also think SF has particularly bad startup culture because of the particular VCs there, but that's a matter of preference. I'd rather work on "boring" startups with gray-haired industry veterans than a moonshot with arrogant, unproven 28 year olds who went to Stanford.
      - iancmceachern 4y ago
        It really sounds like you have a chip, or a few, on your shoulder. My wife and I were born and educated in the Denver area. We owned a home in the area with a mortgage way less than thr rents were talking about here. We tried to live in the area while progressing my career but there are real limitations. Once we moved to the bay area my career totally blossomed. It was indeed a lifestyle change. Back to the topic at hand, giving OP advice. He didn't post asking for advice on better cost of living, etc. He asked for advice on moving to SF. There is no substitute for your career than spending your younger years in a crucible like the bay area. It's good advice for them to move there while they're young and can take advantage of the connections made and knowledge learned for a lifetime.

by smt88 4y ago

PaulHoule 4y ago

I like the startup scene in NYC myself. Also, like Randy Newman, I love L.A. I think it is a much more “normal” place that the bay area.

hifromLA 4y ago

[flagged]

smt88 4y ago
It has a level of homelessness and drug use that has shocked every American I've known who has visited in the last 5 years. It is on another level.
- hifromLA 4y ago
  You say that as if it’s some big revelation. Everyone knows this by now, but I’m pushing back on the idea that the entire 7x7 is like this. It’s simply not. Could you tell me with a straight face that the Richmond is a hellhole? The sunset? The marina? Noe? Glen park? pac heights? Bernal? There’s a degree of nuance that is missing from the conversation. That is my point.
  - smt88 4y ago
    This 25 year old isn't moving to The Marina or Glen Park, some of the most expensive neighborhoods in the world. He's probably priced out of most of Oakland. Even young people who can afford to live in pleasant parts of SF will be miserable because they'll be surrounded by rich, entitled tech people in their 40s+, not down-to-earth 20-somethings.

screwturner68 4y ago

Of all the "cites" you named Chicago is the most affordable and an actual city. Te big difference is the tech scene isn't nuts like in SV, Austin, etc the money is a lot smaller and the expectations are a lot higher -companies that don't make money aren't funded very long. That said Chicago is ranked the #9 city in North America and # 19 in the world for Startups and as I said compared to other startups in other cities our startups tend to make money. Having been in IT in some capacity for the last 35 years I'd say the IT scene in Chicago is strange and lagging behind other cities for reasons I just can't understand but if I was 24 and from a small town looking for city life Chicago is where I'd want to be- NYC is a close second and it would be number one if the housing was cheaper.

iancmceachern 4y ago

I live in SF, and am from Denver and couldn't disagree more. The tech culture here is second to none, people still come from all over the world to work and study here. Myndvice to OP is to come to SF, get plugged into the tech and startup culture while your still young and can leverage that community and the empowerment that comes with it for the rest of their lives.

smt88 4y ago
You can do those things in other cities too. You don't need to pay $6,000/mo in rent and step over human shit every day to succeed in tech. My net worth is higher than my peers in SF even though I've earned less than them, and it's because the cost of living is out of control. It's not worth the marginal career benefit.
- iancmceachern 4y ago
  I pay $3200 for rent in a great location, a very nice loft. Your right, you don't. You also don't need to go to MiT to succeed in tech - but it really helps.
  - smt88 4y ago
    I pay $2,800 for a 3,200 sqft house in a safe, walkable, quiet neighborhood near downtown with better weather than SF. I'm not saying you can't have a good life in SF, but it's much more common to have a terrible life, and the (small) career opportunities aren't worth. I also think SF has particularly bad startup culture because of the particular VCs there, but that's a matter of preference. I'd rather work on "boring" startups with gray-haired industry veterans than a moonshot with arrogant, unproven 28 year olds who went to Stanford.
    - iancmceachern 4y ago
      It really sounds like you have a chip, or a few, on your shoulder. My wife and I were born and educated in the Denver area. We owned a home in the area with a mortgage way less than thr rents were talking about here. We tried to live in the area while progressing my career but there are real limitations. Once we moved to the bay area my career totally blossomed. It was indeed a lifestyle change. Back to the topic at hand, giving OP advice. He didn't post asking for advice on better cost of living, etc. He asked for advice on moving to SF. There is no substitute for your career than spending your younger years in a crucible like the bay area. It's good advice for them to move there while they're young and can take advantage of the connections made and knowledge learned for a lifetime.