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Can you please explain the pyenv usecase a bit more? Let us say, I needed Py3.6 for something - I can just use virtualenv with appropriate flags to install 3.6

Can you please explain the pyenv usecase a bit more? Let us say, I needed Py3.6 for something - I can just use virtualenv with appropriate flags to install 3.6 tooling. How does PyEnv help further. I have read often pyenv helps maintain different version of python on same system. But if that is also possible by virtualenv/venv what am I missing?

noitpmeder 4y ago
Venv helps maintain separate virtual environments for a given python installation, but it won't actually install python. E.g. if you have Python3.6 installed venv can use it, but you can use PyEnv to install 3.7, 3.8, 3.9, ... Which venv can then use.
- coldtea 4y ago
  Basically Python team sat down to consider how they can make their deployment setup worse, and they came up with the idea to split packaging, dependency management, virtual environments/isolation, and Python version management to each need a different too, and then had different random projects make several tries at of each tool, all at more or less equivalent popularity...
  - InfamousRece 4y ago
    I was told the opposite - that the current mess is because the “Python team” did not sit down to consider deployment setups at all.
woodruffw 4y ago
You're missing that venv and virtualenv can't do that: they can only create environments for your current Python interpreter, not arbitrary Python versions. There's no flag that I'm aware of that makes venv install a different Python version than the one it was invoked with.
- aiiane 4y ago
  The --python flag for virtualenv will let you specify a different Python executable to use, but requires that executable to already be installed somewhere on the system.
  - georgyo 4y ago
    Getting another python executable is normal the challenge though.
    - actually_a_dog 4y ago
      Not really. Not under OSX, brew makes this simple. Under Linux, worst case, you just download the source and compile it. (Not sure about Windows though.)
      - KyeRussell 4y ago
        And pyenv is a wrapper around “downloading the source and compiling it”.
      - 1_1xdev1 4y ago
        Brew makes this easy? Are you sure? I installed python 3.9 with brew and it’s magically become a 3.10 install by upgrading another package
        InvaderFizz 4y ago
        The version pinning on brew certainly isn't great, but you can do: > brew install python@3.9 python@3.10 python@3.11
masklinn 4y ago
> I can just use virtualenv with appropriate flags to install 3.6 tooling. No. I have no idea where you got that idea. > But if that is also possible by virtualenv/venv what am I missing? That it's not possible? venv is literally just a module of the standard distribution. And while virtualenv can do a few more things (hence why it remains as an independent project), installing new pythons is not something it can do. Virtualenv and venv can only create environments for previously installed python (especially venv as you create environments via the python you want to create an env for, it doesn't support creating an env on behalf of a different python than the one it's invoked through).
- srvmshr 4y ago
  Oh, my apologies. I confused that with the conda --python flag. Much appreciated catching that.

noitpmeder 4y ago

Venv helps maintain separate virtual environments for a given python installation, but it won't actually install python. E.g. if you have Python3.6 installed venv can use it, but you can use PyEnv to install 3.7, 3.8, 3.9, ... Which venv can then use.

coldtea 4y ago
Basically Python team sat down to consider how they can make their deployment setup worse, and they came up with the idea to split packaging, dependency management, virtual environments/isolation, and Python version management to each need a different too, and then had different random projects make several tries at of each tool, all at more or less equivalent popularity...
- InfamousRece 4y ago
  I was told the opposite - that the current mess is because the “Python team” did not sit down to consider deployment setups at all.

woodruffw 4y ago

You're missing that venv and virtualenv can't do that: they can only create environments for your current Python interpreter, not arbitrary Python versions. There's no flag that I'm aware of that makes venv install a different Python version than the one it was invoked with.

aiiane 4y ago
The --python flag for virtualenv will let you specify a different Python executable to use, but requires that executable to already be installed somewhere on the system.
- georgyo 4y ago
  Getting another python executable is normal the challenge though.
  - actually_a_dog 4y ago
    Not really. Not under OSX, brew makes this simple. Under Linux, worst case, you just download the source and compile it. (Not sure about Windows though.)
    - KyeRussell 4y ago
      And pyenv is a wrapper around “downloading the source and compiling it”.
    - 1_1xdev1 4y ago
      Brew makes this easy? Are you sure? I installed python 3.9 with brew and it’s magically become a 3.10 install by upgrading another package
      - InvaderFizz 4y ago
        The version pinning on brew certainly isn't great, but you can do: > brew install python@3.9 python@3.10 python@3.11

masklinn 4y ago

> I can just use virtualenv with appropriate flags to install 3.6 tooling. No. I have no idea where you got that idea. > But if that is also possible by virtualenv/venv what am I missing? That it's not possible? venv is literally just a module of the standard distribution. And while virtualenv can do a few more things (hence why it remains as an independent project), installing new pythons is not something it can do. Virtualenv and venv can only create environments for previously installed python (especially venv as you create environments via the python you want to create an env for, it doesn't support creating an env on behalf of a different python than the one it's invoked through).

srvmshr 4y ago
Oh, my apologies. I confused that with the conda --python flag. Much appreciated catching that.