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What if ISO 9001 certification also created individual criminal liability for conformance? Individual criminal liability would drive accountability down to the

What if ISO 9001 certification also created individual criminal liability for conformance? Individual criminal liability would drive accountability down to the people who are actually responsible for the necessary actions. The criminal threat empowers individuals, creating a drive for clear understanding of their roles, deliverables, and artifacts of completion. This accountability works successfully in the aviation industry but comes at a high cost. Could it work in other industries and could newer technologies lower the cost of implementation? Easier workflow management tools? What would happen in your company if you or your team members were at risk of criminal investigation for compliance to your ISO 9001 procedures & documentation? Could you do it? Would you stay? Would you want more money? Isn't it essentially commercial fraud if the organization IS NOT meeting their documented procedures?

aplusbi 4y ago
I feel like this would end up with a bunch of interns in prison for the crimes of executives. It would be too easy to find a scapegoat.
ok_dad 4y ago
> What if ISO 9001 certification also created individual criminal liability for conformance? I worked at an ISO-13485 certified company, and actually had "criminal liability for conformance" for some work I did there, due to the FDA's regulations. I can say, for certain, that it does not matter if you raise issues for legal obligations with even one of the largest medical device manufacturers in the USA. I had some HR issues there with my boss which edged into the region of not doing our jobs properly for important quality inspections. He did eventually get fired, but not for risking the lives of patients but he was instead fired for missing some milestone obligations on an important project. I was turned into a pariah with management for trying to fix this particular issue, and later I quit my management position there in order to live a life of simplicity as a solo-contributor of software for my remaining days. I say that you absolutely cannot push the liability down to the worker level, it has to be on management and on the executives of a company. It would be much easier for workers to raise safety and HR issues at a company if they knew that their medical coverage and salary were safe, such as with universal healthcare or UBI...

aplusbi 4y ago

I feel like this would end up with a bunch of interns in prison for the crimes of executives. It would be too easy to find a scapegoat.

ok_dad 4y ago

> What if ISO 9001 certification also created individual criminal liability for conformance? I worked at an ISO-13485 certified company, and actually had "criminal liability for conformance" for some work I did there, due to the FDA's regulations. I can say, for certain, that it does not matter if you raise issues for legal obligations with even one of the largest medical device manufacturers in the USA. I had some HR issues there with my boss which edged into the region of not doing our jobs properly for important quality inspections. He did eventually get fired, but not for risking the lives of patients but he was instead fired for missing some milestone obligations on an important project. I was turned into a pariah with management for trying to fix this particular issue, and later I quit my management position there in order to live a life of simplicity as a solo-contributor of software for my remaining days. I say that you absolutely cannot push the liability down to the worker level, it has to be on management and on the executives of a company. It would be much easier for workers to raise safety and HR issues at a company if they knew that their medical coverage and salary were safe, such as with universal healthcare or UBI...