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The 15-Minute City: Where Urban Planning Meets Conspiracy Theories
- carride 4y agohttps://archive.md/kZxpb https://archive.md/kZxpb
- wussboy 4y agoMaybe it’s not such a great thing that we all have an equal voice.
- Mountain_Skies 4y agoWe're all equal, but some are more equal than others.
- LatteLazy 4y agoPeople are equal but that doesn't mean they're equally smart or honest.
- supertrope 4y agoDon't worry. Our democracy already ignores the voices of the bottom 40%. And mostly listens to the top 0.01%.
- LatteLazy 4y agoIt's important not to actually try to address this nonsense. The idea here not to honestly engage. It's to oppose all change on principal, and pretend it's for some reason (the theory) when it's really just a matter of (bad) personal choices. It's the equivalent of the Chewbacca defence but for public discourse: no one can make any progress if someone just screams nonsense constantly and that suits the person screaming...
- aquarium87 4y agoAnd what if governments are always spouting nonsense and implementing it because they have nothing better to do? I don't know these as 15 minute cities, I know these as anti-urban sprawl, pro-environment, anti-car neighborhoods. And the push has been on for over a decade to make this happen. Now that it's here, it's worse than thought. It's not just planning these things and letting people live and work close to home or not. It's more of a forcing function where the entire system is built as a turn-key totalitarian physical prison. Only a fool would buy into this. And yet the places where these decisions are made (city council), nobody cares about and big money will pour in. It only takes 6 figures in a 5 figure race to buy a couple seats and implement radical environmental anti-human policy.
- LatteLazy 4y agoWell I don't think anyone is buying politicians for PRO environmental legislation but... I have to give you credit: at least you are just up front about not wanting this. That's fine. You're a citizen with a right to a view etc. I only object when people start pretending it's all part of some shadow government, new world order, lizard people plot...
- aquarium87 4y agoAnd yet it is. But not the way you think. It's all about elite groupthink. They have drinks and talk stuff over and turn their noses up at each other until they are on the same page as to what is desirable and then judge each other based on these elitist social goals and who can achieve them and cement their names immortal. And anyone that gets in the way.... Fired, defunded, shunned, labeled conspiracy theorist etc. And just you wait. The money isn't flowing yet, but it will. For a city of a million people, maybe buying 8-10 councillors for $100,000 each will accomplish any goal. And noone cares enough about city politics to stop that kind of thing.
- briandon 4y agoIn the most-detailed example of such initiatives described in the article, the steps taken in Oxford include ALPR-camera-triggered automated fines for driving on certain roadways at certain times of certain days to those "without a permit" (who is eligible for the special permits, how eligibility is determined, etc. is not discussed) and actual blocking of other streets using bollards (and heavy planters and other obstacles). Pointing out that the authorities implementing such schemes are attempting to reduce individual freedom of movement and action is factual, not a conspiracy theory.
- LatteLazy 4y agoIt's not really. There is no conspiracy about closing roads to make them into pedestrian areas. No one claims fining someone for driving through a park would be a "conspiracy"...
- briandon 4y agoDriving through a park is already prohibited. The initiative is describing paved roadways. In Oxford, the ability to drive on particular existing streets (streets, not parkland) is to be turned into a privilege, allegedly at certain times on certain days, and those who use those existing roadways without having new, specific permits will be automatically fined. From the article: Officials in Oxford approved a plan last year to install “traffic filters,” which would limit access on six roads in the city during certain times of day. The filters are cameras, not physical barriers, that take photos of vehicles’ license plates. Fines are then issued to those without a permit.
- LatteLazy 4y agoYou're still not actually describing a conspiracy though are you? And it is standard for roads to stop being roads, to become limited or no access to vehicles etc. Suddenly we're meant to think the illuminate are behind the fact only the park staff can drive through the park or only local residents can park in some places. But it's not true. Just say "I like driving and want to drive a lot". There is no need to pretend that the UN and GoldmanSachs are plotting against you!?
- stuckinhell 4y ago[flagged]
- fwungy 4y ago[flagged]
- supertrope 4y agoUrban sprawl was official US Government policy from the end of WW2 until only fairly recently. It's not the natural order of things. Toll free interstate highways, government underwritten mortgages. Suburbs are attractive with those interventions. At the local level strict zoning still chokes off housing construction and mandated minimum parking results in the majority of urban land sitting idle ready for peak parking demand one day a year instead of actual use as a destination.
- CodeWriter23 4y agoCompletely open would include compromising with dissenters. I think you meant “open to the public”.
- tengbretson 4y agoThe role of large cities has typically been to act as an economic and cultural hub to their surrounding area. Cities that restrict access for outsiders to their economic and cultural areas will probably thrive in the short-term, but over the long term I suspect they will be replaced in their role as a regional hub by cities that don't.
- supertrope 4y agoAutomobile dependent zoning regulations favor making driving easy to the detriment to everything else. Entire neighborhoods were bulldozed to make room for highways. Preserving unlimited free parking comes at the expense of rent zooming up due to the new supply of real estate being blocked. There are other ways for people to get downtown. Parking can be pushed to the periphery of the business & entertainment districts. Walk, take a shuttle, or taxi in from there. Parking in a parking garage and walking two blocks is reasonable. Pedestrianized main drags are more lively as people don't feel the pressure of cars bearing down on them as they cross the street. Cars are great tools. We've just gone overboard and don't even throw pedestrians (and dismounted motorists) a bone in the form of sidewalks, safe ways to cross the street, reasonably useful mass transit, and ways to cross over highways without walking an extra mile.
- dsfyu404ed 4y agoThe root cause is the hubris to think we can "centrally plan but not really" utopia with these sorts of broad brush regulatory and carrot/stick policy changes. Suburban sprawl (though they had different words for it) was very much the "15-minute city" urban planning buzzword of its day. As an aside sidewalks are SOP these days in all but the most rural of road projects so progress is being made.
- pjc50 4y agoYou can't not centrally plan a city. Thousands of decisions have to be made every year about roads and traffic.
- supertrope 4y ago
- fwungy 4y agoRemember the conspiracy theory that the present administration wanted to ban gas stoves? It was a lie. They only want to ban half of them, and it wasn't even the President, it's an agency -https://www.eenews.net/articles/doe-rule-may-block-50-of-new-gas-stoves/ https://www.eenews.net/articles/doe-rule-may-block-50-of-new...
- peatmoss 4y agoThis isn't really a new thing. Back when I was a planning masters student ~2009 I remember hearing about how we were part of the U.N.'s "Agenda 21" conspiracy to round up humanity into survivability zones or some such. Most of us were just nerds for public transportation or bicycling, and the idea of riding around in black helicopters sounded very high carbon footprint. Still, it was kind of wild to be implicated in a conspiracy. Except for the few scary times where I encountered people who were true believers, it was maybe even a little fun. After all, the first thing you learn as a planning student / planner in the US, is that you have absolutely no power to do anything.
- dsfyu404ed 4y agoI think the problem is that 9/10 people involved are nerds who genuinely want good things and then 1/10 is a jackbooted jerk who doesn't care about your things except as a means to implementing their jackboot fantasies and the little details they champion poison the whole effort. Like for example having a traffic restricted at certain times road is fine and all. But implementing it with surveillance cameras knowing full well that "gotcha" tickets will be issued to out-of-towners, the system will be laden with all the perverse incentives that red light cameras are known for and that there's some yet to be defined permitting process (i.e. avenue for graft, preferential treatment of various types of uses, etc). Just put a fucking gate on it during the times you want it closed and call it good. Why do they always have to go 1984 like this? Like imagine they did this with a park or some other taxpayer funded resource that's equally open for public use. People wouldn't stand for it.
- janalsncm 4y agoHere’s a conspiracy: car manufacturers don’t want walkable cities.
- fwungy 4y agoLook what's happening to car manufacturers. They're becoming "mobility" companies. They aren't switching to EV because they want to, it makes no sense for them as businesses, in multiple ways. An EV is a commodity vehicle - that's why Apple can build a car without a hundred year history of auto building. The car makers are being forced to do this by policy regulators. The government is essentially managing the auto industry now to force their outcome.
- pjc50 4y ago> The government is essentially managing the auto industry now to force their outcome. Yes, there's a long history of safety and environmental regulation, and the migration away from fossil fuels is just an extension of that, regulating the impact of cars.
- fwungy 4y agoNotice the passive voice.
- janalsncm 4y agoEV or not, having to drive everywhere is poor urban design.
- thegrim22 4y ago[flagged]
- carride 4y agoThe discussion a few days ago when Bloomberg addressed the conspiracy talk https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34966171 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34966171
- dolorian 4y agoPart of the confusion comes from partisan thinking. WEF supports 15 minute cities (aka walkable neighborhoods) because it's a better use of resources, there are benefits for 99%ers and 1%ers alike, urbanists and ruralites. The trouble is that our polarized system means if you think the WEF is evil, then it's impossible for any of their goals to be beneficial to you. Compare: Many people today believe that Hitler was evil, but will accept that projects like the autobahn or innovations in rocketry were mostly beneficial. Dismissing all opposing views as "hateful misinformation" like the WEF and governments do isn't useful either. It convinces those who were suspicious of your motivations that they were right about you. The WEF videos never really explain any of the potential for good, they just exclaim with glee that this is a great opportunity to change the world the way they want. Completely tone deaf, I'd say some of these causes would receive less resistance without WEF "helping". When it comes to the walkable neighborhood issue, the real conspiracy is that automakers "convinced" governments to create infrastructure that's miserable to nagivate without a car. If you've never been to cities outside of north america then you probably don't even know what you're missing. Those who think freedom and privacy are important (I certainly do) might want to consider that a car results in licensing, insurance, license plate tracking and gives cops an excuse to detain you arbitrarily. The last but probably most important issue that gets left unsaid is that the current system won't continue to work. North American cities are broke from (re)building roads to subsidize trucking companies and mcmansion developers, they can't afford to continue doing so without raising taxes 300%. Even bigger: we'll run out of oil in 50 years. We won't run out of energy, just the cheap and easily transportable form that we've become accustomed to. The options are build railways, or quit bothering with silly things like "trade", "travel" and "manufacturing".