6 ms·

Dropped out of tech, arguably more by force than choice. My lifestyle, finances, social life, even country of residence (and by extension my love life) were all

by fwlr 4y ago

Dropped out of tech, arguably more by force than choice. My lifestyle, finances, social life, even country of residence (and by extension my love life) were all balanced on top of that little MacBook Pro. Used it for work, used it to socialize, eventually my brain refused to let me mediate my entire life through a computer any longer and I burned out. Now I work at a hotel! Receptionist, barista, waiter, even some maintenance and housekeeping when there’s a need for an extra pair of hands. It covers my needs financially and I get to interact with dozens of new people on a daily basis, which has proven absurdly healthy for me. Still “do tech” in my spare time, but now there’s no pressure, only desire. It’s better for me, but I would hesitate to generally recommend this model of “become sustainable outside of tech and then dip your toes in as you like” - it probably only works because I have previous tech experience, and I am far less productive now as well. But maybe it is not a bad idea for techies burning out.

GoToRO 4y ago
I would guess the one big difference is respect. For some reason, there is no respect for tech workers.
- tetromino_ 4y ago
  But tech workers get far more respect than people in OP's current role of a receptionist, barista, waiter, and/or housekeeping.
  - GoToRO 4y ago
    Working with the public is different and yes, worse that software development. I was referring more to interactions with your boss or colleagues.
  - michaelt 4y ago
    By most measures, yes. Tech workers get more money, better hours, easier working conditions, and will impress your partner's parents more. But I'd wager the barista gets thanked more often, and their customers like them more.
    - tetromino_ 4y ago
      Some customers will like them. Some will thank them - and once in a blue moon, even thank them sincerely. But a small but non-zero subset of customers will scream in their face, curse them out in graphic terms, and threaten to get them fired or arrested for some perceived slight or mistake. And a larger subset will very obviously treat them as "servant class".
    - tekla 4y ago
      I'm going to guess you have never worked a service job. It sucks. People suck, you get yelled at, insulted, demeaned, shit pay, long hours. Tech work is the cushiest job ever. It takes almost no effort to get into, you get paid insanely well, and skills are always in demand. What is there to complain about?
      - seanw444 4y ago
        It's a nice field in comparison for sure. But some people really do have bad experiences in tech.
      - michaelt 4y ago
        You did notice the first line of my post, right? Where I said by most measures tech work is a better job? :)
- weakfish 4y ago
  How?
- Version467 4y ago
  What do you mean by that? Admittedly, I'm not in the US, but it seems to me that tech work is a very respected profession. Especially compared to service work. The notion that someone would leave the tech world for a job in the service industry because it comes with more respect is absolutely wild to me. That's so far away from my personal experience I honestly can't fit it into my mental model of the world. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, or maybe your experience is actually super different from mine. Either way I'd be very interested in an elaboration.
  - selimthegrim 4y ago
    > The notion that someone would leave the tech world for a job in the service industry because it comes with more respect is absolutely wild to me. There are definitely tourist-heavy parts of the US where this is absolutely true.
  - GoToRO 4y ago
    (not US) It seems the whole setup is constructed to make you feel bad, no appreciation for work delivered, every technical argument is seen as an excuse, deadlines have nothing to do with reality an so on. When I interacted with blue collars, they got more respect from their boss or colleagues. Of course, "working with the public" is different and I would guess the only job that is more toxic than programming.
    - gvedem 4y ago
      >It seems the whole setup is constructed to make you feel bad, no appreciation for work delivered, every technical argument is seen as an excuse, deadlines have nothing to do with reality an so on it seems like everyone in this thread saying "tech workers get no respect" actually just work for shit companies...
      - ornornor 4y ago
        There are a lot of shit companies out there. In fact, I’d posit the average company is a shit company.
- fwlr 4y ago
  Obviously I can’t speak to your experiences, but I definitely got more respect working as a developer than I do as a receptionist.
  - roland35 4y ago
    This seems a little bit ridiculous to be honest. I know some developers don't feel respected, but I think a lot of this is due to poor communication skills honestly
- projectazorian 4y ago
  If you’re in SF, NYC, or another major city, anyone not in tech or an adjacent field sees you as a techbro gentrifier who is ruining their city. That makes it hard to make friends. You’re basically starting out at -20 reputation with 60-70% of people you meet.
- jjav 4y ago
  > I would guess the one big difference is respect. For some reason, there is no respect for tech workers. Perhaps OP meant as a trend over time? That has truth to it if you compare going back to the early 90s (my frame of reference). In the 90s programming was not that well-paid, but was a very respected role in the companies I and my circle of programmer friends inhabited. A programmer/sysadmin was a wizard and treated as such. It was a vastly more fun industry to be in even if salaries were just regular white-collar professional level. Slowly in the 00s after the dot com crash that seems to have vanished even as salaries started to climb. An in the 2010s programming became a low-level job where all the decision making power was removed from programmers and handed over to PMs. Now programmers are seens as replaceable worker units to be micromanaged to death via agile and daily status reports. In other words, not respected professionals anymore. The insane salaries kind of make up for the loss of respect, but not fully. For the first couple decades of my career I always felt this was the best field of work ever, and it was. These days though, as I look at my high school peers who went into medicine, law, accounting I have to wonder. They all get ever more respected in their fields as they gain more experience, very much not the case in software anymore.
detourdog 4y ago
I work as a janitor in the building I own and I love it. The problems people bring to me are so realistic and easy to solve. The worse thing that could happen is I have to call a tradesmen. I have about 24 bills to pay a year. The real world happens at such a manageable scale compared to technology. The stress of being a System Administrator was such a low-level hum I didn't know it was there.
- bityard 4y ago
  Wow! I've been dabbling in real estate investment as a potential escape hatch from tech and I'd love to hear more about this!
  - detourdog 4y ago
    What can I say. I bought an old school house around 2 miles from my house spent a fortune turning into a mixed use building. Each classroom is a studio apartment. I had a fiber line installed. I guess the only thing I can say is that 8 units was a magic number for me. The idea is that if one should pay about 25% as rent. 8 units represent 200% of the average income of my town. The downside is that all the serious building code laws start above 5 units. This means I must comply with ADA, Fire protection, and many others. I don't resent this. They all seem like fair if costly rules. I prefer a single building to multiple smaller units. A single building helps me focus and I only have one location to be at besides home. view.cogs.com
    - cushychicken 4y ago
      That's a neat old building. You're in a cool corner of MA, too. I love North Adams.
      - detourdog 4y ago
        I love it here stop by next time you are around.
        4y ago
napoleongl 4y ago
I once made the opposite journey and I miss the front desk daily. I have even considered finding a nice hotel where I could do the occasional weekend shift just to do something more mentally rewarding than architecting solutions, detailing user stories and testing implementation all day!
qazxcvbnmlp 4y ago
I have a part time job loading bags on airplanes and doing a bit of gate/ ticket counter customer service. It's amazing the difference it makes in my daily well being - as you say, interacting with new people and working with your hands is very much more satisfying at the end of the day. Getting a delayed passenger to their destination is a much more tangible problem, then coding for some ill-defined business need. Still doing tech, but I have a much better outlook and productivity now.

by fwlr 4y ago

GoToRO 4y ago

I would guess the one big difference is respect. For some reason, there is no respect for tech workers.

tetromino_ 4y ago
But tech workers get far more respect than people in OP's current role of a receptionist, barista, waiter, and/or housekeeping.
- GoToRO 4y ago
  Working with the public is different and yes, worse that software development. I was referring more to interactions with your boss or colleagues.
- michaelt 4y ago
  By most measures, yes. Tech workers get more money, better hours, easier working conditions, and will impress your partner's parents more. But I'd wager the barista gets thanked more often, and their customers like them more.
  - tetromino_ 4y ago
    Some customers will like them. Some will thank them - and once in a blue moon, even thank them sincerely. But a small but non-zero subset of customers will scream in their face, curse them out in graphic terms, and threaten to get them fired or arrested for some perceived slight or mistake. And a larger subset will very obviously treat them as "servant class".
  - tekla 4y ago
    I'm going to guess you have never worked a service job. It sucks. People suck, you get yelled at, insulted, demeaned, shit pay, long hours. Tech work is the cushiest job ever. It takes almost no effort to get into, you get paid insanely well, and skills are always in demand. What is there to complain about?
    - seanw444 4y ago
      It's a nice field in comparison for sure. But some people really do have bad experiences in tech.
    - michaelt 4y ago
      You did notice the first line of my post, right? Where I said by most measures tech work is a better job? :)
weakfish 4y ago
How?
Version467 4y ago
What do you mean by that? Admittedly, I'm not in the US, but it seems to me that tech work is a very respected profession. Especially compared to service work. The notion that someone would leave the tech world for a job in the service industry because it comes with more respect is absolutely wild to me. That's so far away from my personal experience I honestly can't fit it into my mental model of the world. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, or maybe your experience is actually super different from mine. Either way I'd be very interested in an elaboration.
- selimthegrim 4y ago
  > The notion that someone would leave the tech world for a job in the service industry because it comes with more respect is absolutely wild to me. There are definitely tourist-heavy parts of the US where this is absolutely true.
- GoToRO 4y ago
  (not US) It seems the whole setup is constructed to make you feel bad, no appreciation for work delivered, every technical argument is seen as an excuse, deadlines have nothing to do with reality an so on. When I interacted with blue collars, they got more respect from their boss or colleagues. Of course, "working with the public" is different and I would guess the only job that is more toxic than programming.
  - gvedem 4y ago
    >It seems the whole setup is constructed to make you feel bad, no appreciation for work delivered, every technical argument is seen as an excuse, deadlines have nothing to do with reality an so on it seems like everyone in this thread saying "tech workers get no respect" actually just work for shit companies...
    - ornornor 4y ago
      There are a lot of shit companies out there. In fact, I’d posit the average company is a shit company.
fwlr 4y ago
Obviously I can’t speak to your experiences, but I definitely got more respect working as a developer than I do as a receptionist.
- roland35 4y ago
  This seems a little bit ridiculous to be honest. I know some developers don't feel respected, but I think a lot of this is due to poor communication skills honestly
projectazorian 4y ago
If you’re in SF, NYC, or another major city, anyone not in tech or an adjacent field sees you as a techbro gentrifier who is ruining their city. That makes it hard to make friends. You’re basically starting out at -20 reputation with 60-70% of people you meet.
jjav 4y ago
> I would guess the one big difference is respect. For some reason, there is no respect for tech workers. Perhaps OP meant as a trend over time? That has truth to it if you compare going back to the early 90s (my frame of reference). In the 90s programming was not that well-paid, but was a very respected role in the companies I and my circle of programmer friends inhabited. A programmer/sysadmin was a wizard and treated as such. It was a vastly more fun industry to be in even if salaries were just regular white-collar professional level. Slowly in the 00s after the dot com crash that seems to have vanished even as salaries started to climb. An in the 2010s programming became a low-level job where all the decision making power was removed from programmers and handed over to PMs. Now programmers are seens as replaceable worker units to be micromanaged to death via agile and daily status reports. In other words, not respected professionals anymore. The insane salaries kind of make up for the loss of respect, but not fully. For the first couple decades of my career I always felt this was the best field of work ever, and it was. These days though, as I look at my high school peers who went into medicine, law, accounting I have to wonder. They all get ever more respected in their fields as they gain more experience, very much not the case in software anymore.

detourdog 4y ago

I work as a janitor in the building I own and I love it. The problems people bring to me are so realistic and easy to solve. The worse thing that could happen is I have to call a tradesmen. I have about 24 bills to pay a year. The real world happens at such a manageable scale compared to technology. The stress of being a System Administrator was such a low-level hum I didn't know it was there.

bityard 4y ago
Wow! I've been dabbling in real estate investment as a potential escape hatch from tech and I'd love to hear more about this!
- detourdog 4y ago
  What can I say. I bought an old school house around 2 miles from my house spent a fortune turning into a mixed use building. Each classroom is a studio apartment. I had a fiber line installed. I guess the only thing I can say is that 8 units was a magic number for me. The idea is that if one should pay about 25% as rent. 8 units represent 200% of the average income of my town. The downside is that all the serious building code laws start above 5 units. This means I must comply with ADA, Fire protection, and many others. I don't resent this. They all seem like fair if costly rules. I prefer a single building to multiple smaller units. A single building helps me focus and I only have one location to be at besides home. view.cogs.com
  - cushychicken 4y ago
    That's a neat old building. You're in a cool corner of MA, too. I love North Adams.
    - detourdog 4y ago
      I love it here stop by next time you are around.
      - 4y ago

napoleongl 4y ago

I once made the opposite journey and I miss the front desk daily. I have even considered finding a nice hotel where I could do the occasional weekend shift just to do something more mentally rewarding than architecting solutions, detailing user stories and testing implementation all day!

qazxcvbnmlp 4y ago

I have a part time job loading bags on airplanes and doing a bit of gate/ ticket counter customer service. It's amazing the difference it makes in my daily well being - as you say, interacting with new people and working with your hands is very much more satisfying at the end of the day. Getting a delayed passenger to their destination is a much more tangible problem, then coding for some ill-defined business need. Still doing tech, but I have a much better outlook and productivity now.