3 ms·
> Is the word “client” offensive? Stanford apparently thinks so Has someone singled you out and told you that you're being offensive for using the word "client
by smcl 4y ago
> Is the word “client” offensive? Stanford apparently thinks so
Has someone singled you out and told you that you're being offensive for using the word "client"? I suspect not, I think you've overreacted to this a bit. The document you linked has this in its third paragraph:
> The purpose of this website is to educate people about the possible impact of the words we use. We are not attempting to assign levels of harm to the terms on this site. We also are not attempting to address all informal uses of language.
So they're stating ahead of time they're not trying to get rid of this and create a form of "newspeak" or whatever, they're outlining some words some people use that have a variety of different implications and suggesting some alternatives to them in some contexts. The word "client" is under their "Imprecise" section, they suggest "user" instead. It is worth noting that I have personally encountered its ambiguity - a “client” in my current role can variously mean:
- a user or a person
- one of the accounts of that user/person
- a hospital or healthcare provider
- the application calling an API (“client” in OpenID Connect)
- a package/lib we published to call an API
We can either live with the idea that “client” is always going to need clarification, or start using the terms Person, Account, Organization, Client and API Client (respectively).
> Is “blind” offensive to blind people? Is “mother” offensive?
Have you been confronted for saying "blind" or "mother"? This sounds very hypothetical. If you want to have my feelings on “blind” check out what I said about “deaf” https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35007350 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35007350 - two of the words interpreted as euphemisms were actually broader than strictly "deaf", and one sounded comical.
> Should I feel embarrassed for being “out of touch” because I don’t side with the censors here?
You've mixed things up a bit here, and I hope it was by accident so I'll clarify. This "embarrassed" was me contextualising what people feel in the situation where, for example, Andy uses an antiquated and offensive term to refer to an ethnic minority without realising it, then Bob corrects them. In your terms Bob has "policed" Andy, and it's not nice to feel that. I'm saying that what's actually happening here is Andy is embarrassed or ashamed, which is a thing that can happen easily (they could've called Andy "Albert" or farted or something else) and that's why they feel bad. What happens next is on Andy - they could do what they do in all other embarrassing situations and say "ah sorry I didn't realise" or they could fly off the handle and dig their heels in. There's obviously a limit to how forgiving people are, I don't think Andy would get off lightly for using the n-word, for example.
So I can't think why you should feel embarrassed about the existence of this document, but I also can't think why you'd get so upset about it if it isn't affecting how you talk or causing problems in your life.
> I would angry at people who demand I stop calling my mother my mother
Who is demanding that? Is someone in your life telling you to do this? If they are - tell them to fuck off, that's none of their business. If not ... why are you inventing a situation where someone tells you not to call your mother "mother"?
With the situations you've brought up, it sounds like you're more annoyed about the idea of being told what to say, than anyone actually doing it to you. That sounds anxiety-inducing but I don't know what I can suggest that would help. For what it's worth if you're a famous Gen Z streamer then yeah you're going to be held to some pretty high standards language-wise, and people will outright be looking to cause drama (and tbh they often court it and play it up themselves but that's another matter). The rest of us aren't held to that standard, and normally people don't enter a conversation looking to destroy their conversation partner, they usually go in with best intentions and if you meet them at that level and act respectfully there's not a great deal that can go wrong. When that's not the case (in a small amount of situations) and you're dealing with an oddball, you can excuse yourself or you can nod along and then later text your partner or best friend about the weirdo you spoke to :) It's very unlikely they would be in a position to cause you any trouble in either case.
- josephg 4y ago> Have you been confronted for saying "blind" or "mother"? This sounds very hypothetical. I brought up blind people and mothers to reference other parts of this thread. Seems like the thread has gotten a lot longer since I read it, and I suppose its context can't be assumed now. Blind people[1], Mothers: > For example, it seems like we can't say "mother" anymore in medical settings. For my partner's entire pregnancy, our providers only referred to "birthing people" because of some tiny number of trans men that exist and also want to give birth. I support trans people living however they want, but my mother was a mother, goddammit, not a "birthing person", and I don't appreciate anyone implying that this word and identity are somehow offensive. At work, a "women in engineering" group got renamed to something bland like "gender minorities in tech". https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35000800 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35000800 Imagine what its like as an employee at a hospital with that policy. You might personally disagree with it, but what are you going to do? Have a friendly chat with HR about it? (And risk your career in the process?) Or get in line, but feel torn up inside about it? > for example, Andy uses an antiquated and offensive term to refer to an ethnic minority without realising it, then Bob corrects them. In your terms Bob has "policed" Andy Thats not what comes to mind when I think about andy having his words policed. I think about things like, people getting viciously attacked on social media for not being woke enough (like what has apparently happened to knitters on instagram[2], and to the young adult fiction community). Or people being told at your workplace that all mention of the word "mother" is banned, that the word is only spoken by antisocial people and the implication hanging that anyone who uses that term will be fired. Its this "my way or banishment" attitude that makes people feel afraid and angry. Yes; this also happens in 1-on-1 conversations. But as you say, its rarer there. Its so much worse in larger groups like communities and workplaces. When Stanford publishes a list of "harmful language", or Google adds an AI-powered "inclusive language detector" to google docs[3], they're not having a one-on-one conversation - with all the subtly that comes along with that. They're a powerful institution enforcing their politics by telling their employees what words and ideas will put your job at risk. If you disagree with the opinions of people on instagram, or twitter, or your employer, there's no subtly. And usually no room for differences of opinion. People either get in line, or they risk getting ostracized from their community and fired from their job. Google has made their stance on this quite clear. Employees either toe the company line re: politics, or they get fired. The same is happening in the academy, and plenty of other places. The intention might be good, but there's a lot of diversity of opinion that is being suppressed as a result. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35006381 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35006381 [2] https://unherd.com/2020/01/cast-out-how-knitting-fell-into-a-purity-spiral/ https://unherd.com/2020/01/cast-out-how-knitting-fell-into-a... [3] https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7dk8m/googles-ai-powered-inclusive-warnings-feature-is-very-broken https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7dk8m/googles-ai-powered-in...