8 ms·

Identity politics is not unintentional. Those indoctrinated into it may be unaware but the intention is to divide us.

by trompetenaccoun 4y ago

jraph 4y ago
> the intention is to divide us Who actually has this intention and why?
- meany 4y ago
  In general, creating division between classes, races, religious groups presents opportunities for individuals to gather power by taking up the cause for one group. By establishing an “other” you have an enemy to rally support for your leadership. This is the basis of power for every demagogue from the Cleon in Athens to Joe McCarthy and the American Red Scare. This is also a core theme in Orwell’s 1984. In the context of the OPs topic, there are those who honestly are trying to improve the world, but many people have new found careers and political power created by the division on both the Right and Left.
  - jraph 4y ago
    Still not buying this in the current context but interested if you have any concrete example.
    - lazyeye 4y ago
      This is like someone swimming in an ocean asking for proof that water is wet.
    - kodt 4y ago
      Concentration of wealth under capitalism?
- JacobThreeThree 4y ago
  The "who" is pretty easy - it's corporate media outlets: https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/media-great-racial-awakening https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/media-great...
  - andrekandre 4y ago
    while i dont find that conclusion unbelievable at all, that article excluding fox news is a smell to me, not gonna lie
kenjackson 4y ago
While partially true, what most fail to see is that identity politics is played by virtually everyone. It’s just “your” side is the right approach and “not really identity politics”.
- sangnoir 4y ago
  Identity politics has been the bedrock of American politics since before the Mayflower Pilgrims[1] landed at Plymouth rock, and hasn't ever stopped for even a day. Any claims of recency says a lot about the speaker rather than reality. 1. That they were "pilgrims" is enough evidence. All the jey moments in American history are underpinned by "identity politics": the the 13 colonies, manifest destiny, expansinf west, the declaration of independence, slavery, civil war, reconstruction - all of it.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
cutemonster 4y ago
I think that's not the only reason, sometimes not a reason at all. Instead, 1, sometimes, someone is looking to make a career, or get a job, make money. And then, in identity politics, they might see an opportunity. Career, status, money then being a goal, and any division a side effect. And, 2, I'm not saying that identity politics is or would always be bad or anything like that. So many unfairness in the world, to try to correct.
- strix_varius 4y ago
  Exactly. The average DEI director salary is $200k: https://www.salary.com/research/salary/alternate/diversity-equity-and-inclusion-director-salary https://www.salary.com/research/salary/alternate/diversity-e...
yosito 4y ago
What if we all just stopped for a second and realized that no matter what "side" we're on, we're all just human beings? Namaste.
- wholinator2 4y ago
  I mean, this sets off my satire alarms but wouldn't that be a worthy goal? We can cynically deride all attempts to connect humanity as worthless hippy mumbo jumbo, and while I think perfect adherence would be impossible, I think a step or two in that direction is both possible and beneficial for us. This cynical attitude (assuming satire) is exactly the type of thing preventing us from making that kind of progress.
  - alexvoda 4y ago
    Call me a cynic but I am all for that. And afterwards you encounter the flat earthers and the holocaust deniers and the Putins and Alex Jones of the world and all kinds of other extremists in all kinds of extremes of all directions. And then it's not so simple.
  - yosito 4y ago
    I wasn't being satirical.
- Der_Einzige 4y ago
  I wish we could ban cliches on HN. This has less value than "we live in a society"
pas 4y ago
Well, it's a newish power niche that's getting exploited. (One (postmodern) interpretation is that it's yet another "society of control" in crisis. Basically, the old tools that provided stability (social conventions, morals, beliefs/prejudices) all used to look like big formalish institutions, from family-school-factory-military-prison, and you were either in the system or completely out of it. But as this system of systems post-WWII has "eaten the world" it's now bound to face its own limitations, hence the crisis. Hence all the reforms, real and so-called ones.) The niche is (was) that most people has (had) only a super basic over-simplistic belief about language, which could be summed up as "something something the n-word". Instead of the more correct "when talking to/about someone it's very disrespectful to call them names they don't like".
andrekandre 4y ago
if the intention is to divide, then in the alternate scenario where those divided are united, the question becomes united for what and against whom?

Identity politics is not unintentional. Those indoctrinated into it may be unaware but the intention is to divide us.

jraph 4y ago

> the intention is to divide us Who actually has this intention and why?

meany 4y ago
In general, creating division between classes, races, religious groups presents opportunities for individuals to gather power by taking up the cause for one group. By establishing an “other” you have an enemy to rally support for your leadership. This is the basis of power for every demagogue from the Cleon in Athens to Joe McCarthy and the American Red Scare. This is also a core theme in Orwell’s 1984. In the context of the OPs topic, there are those who honestly are trying to improve the world, but many people have new found careers and political power created by the division on both the Right and Left.
- jraph 4y ago
  Still not buying this in the current context but interested if you have any concrete example.
  - lazyeye 4y ago
    This is like someone swimming in an ocean asking for proof that water is wet.
  - kodt 4y ago
    Concentration of wealth under capitalism?
JacobThreeThree 4y ago
The "who" is pretty easy - it's corporate media outlets: https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/media-great-racial-awakening https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/media-great...
- andrekandre 4y ago
  while i dont find that conclusion unbelievable at all, that article excluding fox news is a smell to me, not gonna lie

kenjackson 4y ago

While partially true, what most fail to see is that identity politics is played by virtually everyone. It’s just “your” side is the right approach and “not really identity politics”.

sangnoir 4y ago
Identity politics has been the bedrock of American politics since before the Mayflower Pilgrims[1] landed at Plymouth rock, and hasn't ever stopped for even a day. Any claims of recency says a lot about the speaker rather than reality. 1. That they were "pilgrims" is enough evidence. All the jey moments in American history are underpinned by "identity politics": the the 13 colonies, manifest destiny, expansinf west, the declaration of independence, slavery, civil war, reconstruction - all of it.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

cutemonster 4y ago

I think that's not the only reason, sometimes not a reason at all. Instead, 1, sometimes, someone is looking to make a career, or get a job, make money. And then, in identity politics, they might see an opportunity. Career, status, money then being a goal, and any division a side effect. And, 2, I'm not saying that identity politics is or would always be bad or anything like that. So many unfairness in the world, to try to correct.

strix_varius 4y ago
Exactly. The average DEI director salary is $200k: https://www.salary.com/research/salary/alternate/diversity-equity-and-inclusion-director-salary https://www.salary.com/research/salary/alternate/diversity-e...

yosito 4y ago

What if we all just stopped for a second and realized that no matter what "side" we're on, we're all just human beings? Namaste.

wholinator2 4y ago
I mean, this sets off my satire alarms but wouldn't that be a worthy goal? We can cynically deride all attempts to connect humanity as worthless hippy mumbo jumbo, and while I think perfect adherence would be impossible, I think a step or two in that direction is both possible and beneficial for us. This cynical attitude (assuming satire) is exactly the type of thing preventing us from making that kind of progress.
- alexvoda 4y ago
  Call me a cynic but I am all for that. And afterwards you encounter the flat earthers and the holocaust deniers and the Putins and Alex Jones of the world and all kinds of other extremists in all kinds of extremes of all directions. And then it's not so simple.
- yosito 4y ago
  I wasn't being satirical.
Der_Einzige 4y ago
I wish we could ban cliches on HN. This has less value than "we live in a society"

pas 4y ago

Well, it's a newish power niche that's getting exploited. (One (postmodern) interpretation is that it's yet another "society of control" in crisis. Basically, the old tools that provided stability (social conventions, morals, beliefs/prejudices) all used to look like big formalish institutions, from family-school-factory-military-prison, and you were either in the system or completely out of it. But as this system of systems post-WWII has "eaten the world" it's now bound to face its own limitations, hence the crisis. Hence all the reforms, real and so-called ones.) The niche is (was) that most people has (had) only a super basic over-simplistic belief about language, which could be summed up as "something something the n-word". Instead of the more correct "when talking to/about someone it's very disrespectful to call them names they don't like".

andrekandre 4y ago

if the intention is to divide, then in the alternate scenario where those divided are united, the question becomes united for what and against whom?