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I'm not arguing what is currently happening or the end result, just that from even my own personal perspective I usually want to ask "is this word okay to use a

I'm not arguing what is currently happening or the end result, just that from even my own personal perspective I usually want to ask "is this word okay to use around you?" instead of just assuming it as such or automatically making someone else responsible for their feelings around my words. You might ultimately be right, but go down that road enough and these people are usually called "assholes" lol. That phrase isn't an indictment of good intentions, just a warning to be aware.

recuter 4y ago
> or automatically making someone else responsible for their feelings around my words If people are not responsible for their own feelings and the onus is on you, you are at their mercy. Some percentage of them are going to abuse you as a result. Where is the win? All you are enabling is psychos and mentally/emotionally unstable people.
- ookblah 4y ago
  Like I said, people ARE ultimately responsible for their own feelings, but that doesn't mean we can't do with erring on the side of empathy in our day-to-day. Don't mistake this for me saying "policing language is fine to preserve someone else's feelings". My comment was mainly to the parent on why it's bad for someone to feel awkward about potentially using a "wrong" word and for me sometimes it stems out of care. All that said, I basically think all this shit gets perverted in the public space where there's a lot more gamesmanship and manipulation.
ramblerman 4y ago
We have millions of years of evolution that allow us to pick up on these subtle signals though. And we are really good at it. Do you think the worry of always having to ask up front (if xyz is ok) comes from ironically a lack of natural empathy in your case?
- ookblah 4y ago
  I mean sure, if I asked up front every single time to the point where people get annoyed? But that's what we are discussing here. Yes, we humans have millions of years ready subtle signals, but we are also really fucking bad at reading minds and knowing what others are thinking. Thus, by clarifying with things like actual words in a direct and non-confrontational way we can actually communicate and understand. I don't know why people are so keen to get me in some kind of "gotcha!" when it's pretty simple what I'm suggesting. Like since when has the intention of wanting to be sure that you're not offending someone become a replacement for inept social person who can't read subtle signs?
  - ramblerman 4y ago
    Your suggestion is akin to the Victorian gentlemen who didn't swear around the ladies and talk about intellectually heavy and upsetting things because they couldn't handle it. It's the opposite of empowering somebody to speak up and decide on their own what they can and can't handle. So yes you might get some pushback when you "simply" suggest we change our interactions.
    - ookblah 4y ago
      what are you even talking about? My original post to the op was about why is it wrong to not want to offend someone? It has nothing to do with trying to dictate anything for the rest of the population, just my opinion. No where do I tell you that it’s better to shut up for fear of offending someone. It’s you who is projecting whatever issue you have with people even remotely suggesting thinking about what we are saying to some greater problem.
      - tremon 4y ago
        why is it wrong to not want to offend someone Because it's patronizing. You can use normal language without intending to offend someone, but if you actively censor your own language in their presence, you're removing their agency.

recuter 4y ago

> or automatically making someone else responsible for their feelings around my words If people are not responsible for their own feelings and the onus is on you, you are at their mercy. Some percentage of them are going to abuse you as a result. Where is the win? All you are enabling is psychos and mentally/emotionally unstable people.

ookblah 4y ago
Like I said, people ARE ultimately responsible for their own feelings, but that doesn't mean we can't do with erring on the side of empathy in our day-to-day. Don't mistake this for me saying "policing language is fine to preserve someone else's feelings". My comment was mainly to the parent on why it's bad for someone to feel awkward about potentially using a "wrong" word and for me sometimes it stems out of care. All that said, I basically think all this shit gets perverted in the public space where there's a lot more gamesmanship and manipulation.

ramblerman 4y ago

We have millions of years of evolution that allow us to pick up on these subtle signals though. And we are really good at it. Do you think the worry of always having to ask up front (if xyz is ok) comes from ironically a lack of natural empathy in your case?

ookblah 4y ago
I mean sure, if I asked up front every single time to the point where people get annoyed? But that's what we are discussing here. Yes, we humans have millions of years ready subtle signals, but we are also really fucking bad at reading minds and knowing what others are thinking. Thus, by clarifying with things like actual words in a direct and non-confrontational way we can actually communicate and understand. I don't know why people are so keen to get me in some kind of "gotcha!" when it's pretty simple what I'm suggesting. Like since when has the intention of wanting to be sure that you're not offending someone become a replacement for inept social person who can't read subtle signs?
- ramblerman 4y ago
  Your suggestion is akin to the Victorian gentlemen who didn't swear around the ladies and talk about intellectually heavy and upsetting things because they couldn't handle it. It's the opposite of empowering somebody to speak up and decide on their own what they can and can't handle. So yes you might get some pushback when you "simply" suggest we change our interactions.
  - ookblah 4y ago
    what are you even talking about? My original post to the op was about why is it wrong to not want to offend someone? It has nothing to do with trying to dictate anything for the rest of the population, just my opinion. No where do I tell you that it’s better to shut up for fear of offending someone. It’s you who is projecting whatever issue you have with people even remotely suggesting thinking about what we are saying to some greater problem.
    - tremon 4y ago
      why is it wrong to not want to offend someone Because it's patronizing. You can use normal language without intending to offend someone, but if you actively censor your own language in their presence, you're removing their agency.