5 ms·

> Today it’s saving the children, tomorrow it’s basically any problem This is how most rights get taken away, not just encryption. Also, we're talking about co

> Today it’s saving the children, tomorrow it’s basically any problem This is how most rights get taken away, not just encryption. Also, we're talking about countries that already have pretty restricted speech. Encryption has to consistently remain popular to survive there, and there are plenty of ways to undermine that.

ultrarunner 4y ago
And it's completely obvious bullshit. Consider any more salient issue affecting children: the leading cause of death for children under 18 is car crashes. The response to this large and growing problem is to a) blame the victims (they shouldn't have been in the road / they should have walked a mile out of their way to return to the spot 100 feet across a road / they weren't wearing construction vests & waving flags / walking to school isn't allowed in the first place) or to wave it away as the cost of doing business. Were there a shred of consistency in actually advocating for children's quality of life, I could forgive those who are duped by these underhanded tactics. As it stands, there's no actual concerted "save the children" bandwagon that we're being invited to hop on to.
- epicureanideal 4y ago
  > As it stands, there's no actual concerted "save the children" bandwagon that we're being invited to hop on to. Maybe one should be created, with a prioritized list of issues, and loudly inform people that if issues at the bottom are being prioritized the proponents may have other motives than the ones they claim.
  - eastbound 4y ago
    Impossible. If you rank avoidable deaths by quantity, men arrive in all the top 10 categories, so I’m pretty sure no-one would want to make this list anyway.
    - hanselot 4y ago
      Don't say that out loud. Clearly nobody is suggesting that on average men flock towards more dangerous higher paying professions which until recently also meant higher wages. Wouldn't want people to make the connection between risk and reward as a factor in economics.
      - hot_gril 4y ago
        Yeah, but I don't know what this has to do with children.
      - andrepd 4y ago
        Yes, CEO is a high-risk profession (you can really hurt your back golfing all day), but coal miner is not. Plus what does this have to do with mortality in children again?
        redeeman 4y ago
        no, you hurt your general well being by working very late, too little sleep, being stressed etc.
        eastbound 4y ago
        They complain about CEOs but they are like 0.1% of the population. Men also flock in the bottom jobs. They don’t even see 90% of the men. But yes, the transition between CEO and homeless is surprisingly sudden. It’s indeed a risky job.
        andrepd 4y ago
        Can't understand if this is satire.
        andrepd 4y ago
        Yep, that's why CEOs work less hours than the average American worker... Come on man, dont buy into the propaganda.
- dane-pgp 4y ago
  > the leading cause of death for children under 18 is car crashes. Are you sure about that? In the US, firearm-related injuries became the leading cause of death among people aged 1 to 19. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761
- Nextgrid 4y ago
  The pretext of child abuse prevention is used as a plausibly-deniable dog whistle to automatically discredit and demonize anyone who dares speak out against the proposed law. It's got nothing to do whether the law would be actually effective at curbing such abuse, whether it will have harmful (seemingly-) unintended consequences, whether other solutions would be more effective or have less potential for unintended consequences, or whether the problem is actually widespread enough to even worry about compared to other risks that affect children.
- andrepd 4y ago
  Very well said, but even if we were talking about just CSA, this is still bullshit: the one thing you can do to help prevent child sexual abuse is to talk to children about sex, taboo-free, and have quality sex ed starting at primary school children. Emphasising consent, explaining what is sex and how it works, how it's not okay for an adult to do it with you, how it's not okay for anyone to touch you without your express consent, inculcating healthy views about relationships and sex from an early age, etc. Unfortunately this is uncomfortable for some people (understandable, it's pretty awkward to talk with a 7yo about sex), but it's what politicians should be pushing if they were really about "saving the children". Monitoring cell phones is not it.

ultrarunner 4y ago

And it's completely obvious bullshit. Consider any more salient issue affecting children: the leading cause of death for children under 18 is car crashes. The response to this large and growing problem is to a) blame the victims (they shouldn't have been in the road / they should have walked a mile out of their way to return to the spot 100 feet across a road / they weren't wearing construction vests & waving flags / walking to school isn't allowed in the first place) or to wave it away as the cost of doing business. Were there a shred of consistency in actually advocating for children's quality of life, I could forgive those who are duped by these underhanded tactics. As it stands, there's no actual concerted "save the children" bandwagon that we're being invited to hop on to.

epicureanideal 4y ago
> As it stands, there's no actual concerted "save the children" bandwagon that we're being invited to hop on to. Maybe one should be created, with a prioritized list of issues, and loudly inform people that if issues at the bottom are being prioritized the proponents may have other motives than the ones they claim.
- eastbound 4y ago
  Impossible. If you rank avoidable deaths by quantity, men arrive in all the top 10 categories, so I’m pretty sure no-one would want to make this list anyway.
  - hanselot 4y ago
    Don't say that out loud. Clearly nobody is suggesting that on average men flock towards more dangerous higher paying professions which until recently also meant higher wages. Wouldn't want people to make the connection between risk and reward as a factor in economics.
    - hot_gril 4y ago
      Yeah, but I don't know what this has to do with children.
    - andrepd 4y ago
      Yes, CEO is a high-risk profession (you can really hurt your back golfing all day), but coal miner is not. Plus what does this have to do with mortality in children again?
      - redeeman 4y ago
        no, you hurt your general well being by working very late, too little sleep, being stressed etc.
        eastbound 4y ago
        They complain about CEOs but they are like 0.1% of the population. Men also flock in the bottom jobs. They don’t even see 90% of the men. But yes, the transition between CEO and homeless is surprisingly sudden. It’s indeed a risky job.
        andrepd 4y ago
        Can't understand if this is satire.
        andrepd 4y ago
        Yep, that's why CEOs work less hours than the average American worker... Come on man, dont buy into the propaganda.
dane-pgp 4y ago
> the leading cause of death for children under 18 is car crashes. Are you sure about that? In the US, firearm-related injuries became the leading cause of death among people aged 1 to 19. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761
Nextgrid 4y ago
The pretext of child abuse prevention is used as a plausibly-deniable dog whistle to automatically discredit and demonize anyone who dares speak out against the proposed law. It's got nothing to do whether the law would be actually effective at curbing such abuse, whether it will have harmful (seemingly-) unintended consequences, whether other solutions would be more effective or have less potential for unintended consequences, or whether the problem is actually widespread enough to even worry about compared to other risks that affect children.
andrepd 4y ago
Very well said, but even if we were talking about just CSA, this is still bullshit: the one thing you can do to help prevent child sexual abuse is to talk to children about sex, taboo-free, and have quality sex ed starting at primary school children. Emphasising consent, explaining what is sex and how it works, how it's not okay for an adult to do it with you, how it's not okay for anyone to touch you without your express consent, inculcating healthy views about relationships and sex from an early age, etc. Unfortunately this is uncomfortable for some people (understandable, it's pretty awkward to talk with a 7yo about sex), but it's what politicians should be pushing if they were really about "saving the children". Monitoring cell phones is not it.