3 ms·

If you've ever worked somewhere where there's been layoffs, you'll know that of the remaining employees, all of the best people immediately start looking for jo

If you've ever worked somewhere where there's been layoffs, you'll know that of the remaining employees, all of the best people immediately start looking for jobs elsewhere. If management is so incompetent that they overhired or underperformed bad enough to lay people off, the writing is on the wall to jump ship. It can take years to repair the motivational and cultural damage caused by a layoff. Especially when paired with "soft" layoff behavior like mandating RTO and "performance" management.

deltree7 4y ago
Where is this magical "elsewhere" part where there would be no layoffs? It's mind-boggling that we have raised a generation of people who are absolutely clueless about "Cost-of-Capital". It is worse than people not understanding democracy
- wootland 4y ago
  > Where is this magical "elsewhere" part where there would be no layoffs? Any company with competent management. That includes not cargo culting layoffs while turning a blind eye to the damage they cause to a company. > It's mind-boggling that we have raised a generation of people who are absolutely clueless about "Cost-of-Capital". It is worse than people not understanding democracy What's mind-boggling is that people think the cost savings from a layoff happens in a vacuum. There are definitely repercussions in terms of loss of productivity, increased employee churn, brand damage, increased difficulty hiring in the future, loss of operational knowledge... Layoff are a sign of mismanagement. That has nothing to do with the "cost-of-capital".
  - deltree7 4y ago
    So you have never created a bug in your life? Made a mistake? Your statement is as naive as "A Production Bug / Latency is a sign of Incompetent Software Developer" Should we fire you as soon as you hit the first bug? BTW, You have a fundamental misunderstanding of Cost of Capital Tomorrow if your salary is cut by 50%, would you cut-down on extra expenses? Is that a sign of mismanagement from you?
    - ztrww 4y ago
      > Tomorrow if your salary is cut by 50%, would you cut-down on extra expenses? Is that a sign of mismanagement from you? if you knowingly and willfully put yourself into a situation which resulted in your salary being cut by 50% then yes
      - s1artibartfast 4y ago
        It's still worth it to a apply for a job that pays double or take a job that pays double. It is only a personal failing if you misunderstand the risk and cost going in. Similarly, if you gamble on a coin flip and lose, that doesn't mean it was a bad bet. It is only a bad bet if you calculate the odds and expected returns incorrectly. People seem to really struggle with this concept
    - wootland 4y ago
      I'm not sure if you replied to the right comment or not since I didn't say anything about firing engineers (or anyone). My point is that over-hiring and layoffs aren't "good for the company" as the post I was responding to claimed. They're both a sign of bad management that incurs a cost on the company being poorly managed. One of those costs is that top performers leave as they are the first to recognize mismanagement.
s1artibartfast 4y ago
I've definitely been through some layoffs where most employees said good riddance and moved on with life immediately, so I think there is definitely some variations in morale response. It is one thing if the layoffs are at a startup running out of money, and another if layoffs are at a profitable company

deltree7 4y ago

Where is this magical "elsewhere" part where there would be no layoffs? It's mind-boggling that we have raised a generation of people who are absolutely clueless about "Cost-of-Capital". It is worse than people not understanding democracy

wootland 4y ago
> Where is this magical "elsewhere" part where there would be no layoffs? Any company with competent management. That includes not cargo culting layoffs while turning a blind eye to the damage they cause to a company. > It's mind-boggling that we have raised a generation of people who are absolutely clueless about "Cost-of-Capital". It is worse than people not understanding democracy What's mind-boggling is that people think the cost savings from a layoff happens in a vacuum. There are definitely repercussions in terms of loss of productivity, increased employee churn, brand damage, increased difficulty hiring in the future, loss of operational knowledge... Layoff are a sign of mismanagement. That has nothing to do with the "cost-of-capital".
- deltree7 4y ago
  So you have never created a bug in your life? Made a mistake? Your statement is as naive as "A Production Bug / Latency is a sign of Incompetent Software Developer" Should we fire you as soon as you hit the first bug? BTW, You have a fundamental misunderstanding of Cost of Capital Tomorrow if your salary is cut by 50%, would you cut-down on extra expenses? Is that a sign of mismanagement from you?
  - ztrww 4y ago
    > Tomorrow if your salary is cut by 50%, would you cut-down on extra expenses? Is that a sign of mismanagement from you? if you knowingly and willfully put yourself into a situation which resulted in your salary being cut by 50% then yes
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      It's still worth it to a apply for a job that pays double or take a job that pays double. It is only a personal failing if you misunderstand the risk and cost going in. Similarly, if you gamble on a coin flip and lose, that doesn't mean it was a bad bet. It is only a bad bet if you calculate the odds and expected returns incorrectly. People seem to really struggle with this concept
  - wootland 4y ago
    I'm not sure if you replied to the right comment or not since I didn't say anything about firing engineers (or anyone). My point is that over-hiring and layoffs aren't "good for the company" as the post I was responding to claimed. They're both a sign of bad management that incurs a cost on the company being poorly managed. One of those costs is that top performers leave as they are the first to recognize mismanagement.

s1artibartfast 4y ago

I've definitely been through some layoffs where most employees said good riddance and moved on with life immediately, so I think there is definitely some variations in morale response. It is one thing if the layoffs are at a startup running out of money, and another if layoffs are at a profitable company