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He fell into greed trap like wolf/s from Wall Street did. It can happen no matter how smart you are.

filoleg 4y ago
The part you mentioned that was referencing The Wolf of Wall Steeet is just plainly untrue. Stratton Oakmont (the OTC brokerage house from The Wolf of Wall Street movie, as well as its real-life counterpart) didn't "fall into greed trap." They have been running their pump and dump schemes (by straight up lying to investors) from the very start and have been scrutinized by National Association of Security Dealers since their founding in 1989[0]. However, I can believe the "fell into greed trap" reasoning for SBF, as it looks this way to me as well. That wasn't the part that made my blood boil, it was all the lies and excuses and pure gaslighting that followed after they got exposed. The crime was bad, but the coverup didn't lag much behind in terms of their awfulness (and arguably imo was much more disgusting). If it was just "oh, we ended up managing risk poorly and decided to yolo the funds on risky funds", that's one (still very criminal and bad) thing. But it is another when you end up covering it up and gaslighting people post-factum. 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratton_Oakmont https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratton_Oakmont
- mrkramer 4y ago
  Don't you think that somebody who invests their time and their mental/intellectual energy into creating and operating fraud schemes isn't somewhat smart. Every big time scammer/fraudster/thief can probably be a successful entrepreneur.
  - filoleg 4y ago
    In some cases, sure. In SBF's case, no. The only parts of his situation that I consider requiring intellectual energy is actually creating and growing the company, which he did. That's not fraud, however. The fraud he commited, on the other hand, was pretty poorly thought through and, if anything, indicates lack of smarts. I don't believe it takes a genius to decide to gamble clients' funds (that you aren't allowed to touch at all) on risky shitcoins, and then attempt to cover it up and lie about it. Which is the fraud that SBF committed. In fact, I think it is one of the dumbest things one could commit. There is virtually no scenario in which it all wouldn't end up crashing down and getting exposed, unless shitcoins kept going up forever. It is especially dumb, considering that the only thing he had to do was not commit the fraud, and FTX would have been alive and well. Note: when I say "shitcoins", I am not referring to all cryptocurrency or any major ones like BTC/ETH. I am talking about coins like MATIC.

The part you mentioned that was referencing The Wolf of Wall Steeet is just plainly untrue. Stratton Oakmont (the OTC brokerage house from The Wolf of Wall Street movie, as well as its real-life counterpart) didn't "fall into greed trap." They have been running their pump and dump schemes (by straight up lying to investors) from the very start and have been scrutinized by National Association of Security Dealers since their founding in 1989[0]. However, I can believe the "fell into greed trap" reasoning for SBF, as it looks this way to me as well. That wasn't the part that made my blood boil, it was all the lies and excuses and pure gaslighting that followed after they got exposed. The crime was bad, but the coverup didn't lag much behind in terms of their awfulness (and arguably imo was much more disgusting). If it was just "oh, we ended up managing risk poorly and decided to yolo the funds on risky funds", that's one (still very criminal and bad) thing. But it is another when you end up covering it up and gaslighting people post-factum. 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratton_Oakmont https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratton_Oakmont

mrkramer 4y ago
Don't you think that somebody who invests their time and their mental/intellectual energy into creating and operating fraud schemes isn't somewhat smart. Every big time scammer/fraudster/thief can probably be a successful entrepreneur.
- filoleg 4y ago
  In some cases, sure. In SBF's case, no. The only parts of his situation that I consider requiring intellectual energy is actually creating and growing the company, which he did. That's not fraud, however. The fraud he commited, on the other hand, was pretty poorly thought through and, if anything, indicates lack of smarts. I don't believe it takes a genius to decide to gamble clients' funds (that you aren't allowed to touch at all) on risky shitcoins, and then attempt to cover it up and lie about it. Which is the fraud that SBF committed. In fact, I think it is one of the dumbest things one could commit. There is virtually no scenario in which it all wouldn't end up crashing down and getting exposed, unless shitcoins kept going up forever. It is especially dumb, considering that the only thing he had to do was not commit the fraud, and FTX would have been alive and well. Note: when I say "shitcoins", I am not referring to all cryptocurrency or any major ones like BTC/ETH. I am talking about coins like MATIC.