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Given that we have people who test various USB-C cables with devices (sometimes destructively)[1], this makes complete sense. The USB-C cable/charger landscape

Given that we have people who test various USB-C cables with devices (sometimes destructively)[1], this makes complete sense. The USB-C cable/charger landscape is crazy and there are a lot of dodgy devices out there. The conservative approach is to only allow the minimum allowed power with unknown cables/chargers. The EU mandate is to avoid having extraneous chargers that can't be used with multiple devices. I don't think there is a mandate for specific rates of charging. [1] https://www.engadget.com/2016-02-03-benson-leung-chromebook-pixel-usb-type-c-test.html https://www.engadget.com/2016-02-03-benson-leung-chromebook-...?

goosedragons 4y ago
Then why didn't Apple limit MacBook charging to only Apple verified cables and chargers back in 2015? Arguably the USB C ecosystem was far more sketch then now and all their laptops draw far more wattage than an iPhone. Or why didn't they do it when the iPad Pro moved to USB C? Doing it on iPhone just seems like an abuse of their oversized power in the smartphone industry.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- mbreese 4y ago
  When running low on battery, people are far more likely to charge their phones with any random cable that's available. Bars, coffee shops, Ubers, airports, etc... frequently have random cables available for charging. Not all of these cables are all that high of quality or USB-IF certified. If you're running low on power for your laptop, you probably have your own charger available to you. It either came with the computer, or you likely bought it to use with the computer. Regardless, your charging mechanism here is probably more trusted. Honestly, if Apple comes out with iPhones with USB-C ports (like we all expect), some charge from a random cable is better than risky levels of high-power charging. This would be a pragmatic choice. If you want to blame anyone in this, blame USB-IF. They are the reason we have this mess to begin with. Apple is stuck here. You're right that they are an oversized power in the phone industry. They are going to get sued either way. You'll either have phones that get bricked because of a low quality cable/charger or people will be mad that their current charger won't work at 20A. Either way, they will get sued over something. At least this way, if they eventually have to relent to allow, they'll have cover for if/when phones get bricked from cheap cables/chargers. To me, this would make more sense from a defensive liability point of view as opposed to an effort to still extract money with the MFi program.
  - rektide 4y ago
    The fearmongering is so intense in these discussions, my word. > You'll either have phones that get bricked because of a low quality cable/charger or people will be mad that their current charger won't work at 20A. This just isn't a real problem. People's phones don't get bricked like this. USB & USB-PD in particular (required for >15W) has very real safety guards, that have worked very well. The compliance testing is more about getting full speed charges. People aren't mad in Android world because their phone isn't charging at max speed- they understand there's different charge rates. IPhone users already face this second situation anyways: if you just buy a random certified lightning cable & charger, it's not going to charge your 20W+ IPhone at max speed, and might even potentially drain while charging. Same thing goes for all this complaining about bad cables. Any cable becomes bad over time, Apple cables included. Plenty of frayed busted old lightning cables are in use right now, and there's incredibly little real world impact for this; it all mostly works and people mostly get that their cable isn't quite in good condition, and if it's working less optimally, they get it. This idea that Apple is some magical cure-all is an absurd fantasy. Apple isn't stuck, the people defending Apple are stuck, inside Castle Apple, and they are too scared to look out over the parapets & see that it's actually a nice day outside.
    - WastingMyTime89 4y ago
      > The fearmongering is so intense in these discussions, my word. The whole discussion makes no sense whatsoever because Android phones have been dominant in Europe forever. They all use usb-c and the apocalypse didn’t happen. It’s just HN being its usual self and ignoring reality.
moogly 4y ago
That was 7 years ago.

goosedragons 4y ago

Then why didn't Apple limit MacBook charging to only Apple verified cables and chargers back in 2015? Arguably the USB C ecosystem was far more sketch then now and all their laptops draw far more wattage than an iPhone. Or why didn't they do it when the iPad Pro moved to USB C? Doing it on iPhone just seems like an abuse of their oversized power in the smartphone industry.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
mbreese 4y ago
When running low on battery, people are far more likely to charge their phones with any random cable that's available. Bars, coffee shops, Ubers, airports, etc... frequently have random cables available for charging. Not all of these cables are all that high of quality or USB-IF certified. If you're running low on power for your laptop, you probably have your own charger available to you. It either came with the computer, or you likely bought it to use with the computer. Regardless, your charging mechanism here is probably more trusted. Honestly, if Apple comes out with iPhones with USB-C ports (like we all expect), some charge from a random cable is better than risky levels of high-power charging. This would be a pragmatic choice. If you want to blame anyone in this, blame USB-IF. They are the reason we have this mess to begin with. Apple is stuck here. You're right that they are an oversized power in the phone industry. They are going to get sued either way. You'll either have phones that get bricked because of a low quality cable/charger or people will be mad that their current charger won't work at 20A. Either way, they will get sued over something. At least this way, if they eventually have to relent to allow, they'll have cover for if/when phones get bricked from cheap cables/chargers. To me, this would make more sense from a defensive liability point of view as opposed to an effort to still extract money with the MFi program.
- rektide 4y ago
  The fearmongering is so intense in these discussions, my word. > You'll either have phones that get bricked because of a low quality cable/charger or people will be mad that their current charger won't work at 20A. This just isn't a real problem. People's phones don't get bricked like this. USB & USB-PD in particular (required for >15W) has very real safety guards, that have worked very well. The compliance testing is more about getting full speed charges. People aren't mad in Android world because their phone isn't charging at max speed- they understand there's different charge rates. IPhone users already face this second situation anyways: if you just buy a random certified lightning cable & charger, it's not going to charge your 20W+ IPhone at max speed, and might even potentially drain while charging. Same thing goes for all this complaining about bad cables. Any cable becomes bad over time, Apple cables included. Plenty of frayed busted old lightning cables are in use right now, and there's incredibly little real world impact for this; it all mostly works and people mostly get that their cable isn't quite in good condition, and if it's working less optimally, they get it. This idea that Apple is some magical cure-all is an absurd fantasy. Apple isn't stuck, the people defending Apple are stuck, inside Castle Apple, and they are too scared to look out over the parapets & see that it's actually a nice day outside.
  - WastingMyTime89 4y ago
    > The fearmongering is so intense in these discussions, my word. The whole discussion makes no sense whatsoever because Android phones have been dominant in Europe forever. They all use usb-c and the apocalypse didn’t happen. It’s just HN being its usual self and ignoring reality.

moogly 4y ago

That was 7 years ago.