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> In many cases we have replaced those personal obligations (e.g. to take care of elders) with abstract government funded systems. I can almost guarantee that

> In many cases we have replaced those personal obligations (e.g. to take care of elders) with abstract government funded systems. I can almost guarantee that young people don't have social security on the top of their minds. It's school school school internship work, that's it. Those bars are raised each year. Leisure time is social media and video games. All that got amplified in 2020. Not hard to see why they're depressed. [Edit] I was standard college undergrad class of 2018, and right on the cutoff for gen Z. Our high school and college class was clearly more studious than class of 2016, and clearly less than class of 2020. I was also right there when childhood became virtual, starting with the iPhone and Facebook in middle school.

rayiner 4y ago
> I can almost guarantee that young people don't have social security on the top of their minds. It's school school school internship work, that's it. Those bars are raised each year. Leisure time is social media and video games. All that got amplified in 2020. Not hard to see why they're depressed. You’re assuming a level of insight into people’s meta-knowledge of their own mental state that I don’t think is warranted. Maybe they’re not thinking of social security, but maybe there’s mental health benefits to caring for elderly grandparents at home that people don’t appreciate. As to leisure—in the 1950s, half of 16-19 year olds had jobs. Today it’s around 30%. Maybe having a real, if menial job is more fulfilling than playing video games or doing bullshit box checking exercises for college applications? That’s a cultural change too.
- hot_gril 4y ago
  Taking care of elderly family members at home went away well before the recent dip in mental health and falls in line with the decline of family values. I'm personally saddened by the change, but I don't think it explains much here. I'm guessing fewer 16-19yo have jobs mainly because school is more important now. College attendance is way up. But more importantly, the whole phone / social media thing is life-sucking even for kids who don't actively engage in it.
- vore 4y ago
  It's incredibly ironic that you're accusing the parent post of "assuming a level of insight into people’s meta-knowledge of their own mental state" while up and down the thread you're making gigantic reactionary assumptions about what cultural factors are causing teens to feel less fulfilled today. It feels good and easy to pine for the "good old days" where 50% of kids flipped burgers at McDonald's or whatever but the fact of the matter is, given how many confounding variables there are, you're just as clueless as anyone else about this. If we're going to make random stabs in the dark and bring in our own bargain basement personal opinions into this, I can tell you at least that interacting with my abusive family much less has only been fantastic for my mental health. Obviously this isn't the case for everyone, but maybe that's not important and I should just universalize this viewpoint like you, right?
  - rayiner 4y ago
    > while up and down the thread you're making gigantic reactionary assumptions about what cultural factors are causing teens to feel less fulfilled today. It feels good and easy to pine for the "good old days" To be clear, Taylor Lorenz is the one pining about the 1950s. She’s the one saying “things are worse now” and arguing that changes since then are making young people unhappy. TFA rejects Lorenz’s premise by pointing out that the economically, young people aren’t worse off. I’m simply pointing out that, unless you want to dismiss Lorenz’s (quite common) view altogether, it’s worth looking at what other things have changed.

rayiner 4y ago

> I can almost guarantee that young people don't have social security on the top of their minds. It's school school school internship work, that's it. Those bars are raised each year. Leisure time is social media and video games. All that got amplified in 2020. Not hard to see why they're depressed. You’re assuming a level of insight into people’s meta-knowledge of their own mental state that I don’t think is warranted. Maybe they’re not thinking of social security, but maybe there’s mental health benefits to caring for elderly grandparents at home that people don’t appreciate. As to leisure—in the 1950s, half of 16-19 year olds had jobs. Today it’s around 30%. Maybe having a real, if menial job is more fulfilling than playing video games or doing bullshit box checking exercises for college applications? That’s a cultural change too.

hot_gril 4y ago
Taking care of elderly family members at home went away well before the recent dip in mental health and falls in line with the decline of family values. I'm personally saddened by the change, but I don't think it explains much here. I'm guessing fewer 16-19yo have jobs mainly because school is more important now. College attendance is way up. But more importantly, the whole phone / social media thing is life-sucking even for kids who don't actively engage in it.
vore 4y ago
It's incredibly ironic that you're accusing the parent post of "assuming a level of insight into people’s meta-knowledge of their own mental state" while up and down the thread you're making gigantic reactionary assumptions about what cultural factors are causing teens to feel less fulfilled today. It feels good and easy to pine for the "good old days" where 50% of kids flipped burgers at McDonald's or whatever but the fact of the matter is, given how many confounding variables there are, you're just as clueless as anyone else about this. If we're going to make random stabs in the dark and bring in our own bargain basement personal opinions into this, I can tell you at least that interacting with my abusive family much less has only been fantastic for my mental health. Obviously this isn't the case for everyone, but maybe that's not important and I should just universalize this viewpoint like you, right?
- rayiner 4y ago
  > while up and down the thread you're making gigantic reactionary assumptions about what cultural factors are causing teens to feel less fulfilled today. It feels good and easy to pine for the "good old days" To be clear, Taylor Lorenz is the one pining about the 1950s. She’s the one saying “things are worse now” and arguing that changes since then are making young people unhappy. TFA rejects Lorenz’s premise by pointing out that the economically, young people aren’t worse off. I’m simply pointing out that, unless you want to dismiss Lorenz’s (quite common) view altogether, it’s worth looking at what other things have changed.