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"The ability to play chess is the sign of a gentleman. The ability to play chess well is the sign of a wasted life." Paul Murphy.
by sadhorse 4y ago
"The ability to play chess is the sign of a gentleman. The ability to play chess well is the sign of a wasted life." Paul Murphy.
- Bootvis 4y agoPaul Morphy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Morphy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Morphy
- ycombinete 4y agoSeneca was of a similar opinion: It would be a lengthy business to mention all the different people who have spent their lives engaged in chess-playing or exercise with ball or the practice of roasting their bodies in the sun. They are not unoccupied when their pleasure form such a busy occupation. No one will doubt that those men are energetic triflers who devote their hours to the study of useless literature - On the Shortness of Life
- TechBro8615 4y agoThat's weird, since chess didn't exist when Seneca was alive. Perhaps that's a mistranslation and he was referring to Ludus latrunculorum? [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludus_latrunculorum https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludus_latrunculorum
- DC-3 4y agoMistranslation is unfair. It's a translation that best reflects the spirit of the original. It would be distracting to the modern reader to refer to a game which would be obscure and unfamiliar, when most likely the point of the original text is to invoke a board game which would be universally known among the audience. That said, you are right: https://la.wikisource.org/wiki/De_brevitate_vitae https://la.wikisource.org/wiki/De_brevitate_vitae > XIII 1. Persequi singulos longum est, quorum aut latrunculi aut pila aut excoquendi in sole corporis cura consumpsere vitam. Non sunt otiosi, quorum voluptates multum negotii habent. Nam de illis nemo dubitabit, quin operose nihil agant, qui litterarum inutilium studiis detinentur, quae iam apud Romanos quoque magna manus est. (emphasis mine)
- fasterik 4y ago>It would be distracting to the modern reader to refer to a game which would be obscure and unfamiliar I find it far more distracting to find a modern term in an ancient text that I know the author couldn't have known about. It's jarring and anachronistic. I would much rather see the original term. I can make a decision about whether to spend a minute to look it up (and learn something!) or skim over it if the meaning is clear enough.
- poulsbohemian 4y agoAgreed - a nice footnote would be appropriate.
- ycombinete 4y agoI have to agree. It was jarring to me to find this in my translation. I think either the original term with a footnote, or perhaps something more generic like “Boardgames”
- ormaybethizzy 4y agoOr maybe Senet https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senet https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senet
- groffee 4y agoInterestingly this has just come up again recently with the 'dahl' controversy.[0] [0] https://classicalwisdom.substack.com/p/should-we-update-old-texts https://classicalwisdom.substack.com/p/should-we-update-old-...
- TechBro8615 4y agoCatullus 16 is certainly problematic! (It was also the only homework assignment that students begged to complete in my Latin course) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16
- martinjacobd 4y agoConsidering that we don't have any history of chess until more than 500 years after Seneca's death, in India no less, I think it's fair to say that this is yet another example of "ye olde translationes" editorializing and using too much dynamic equivalence. latrunculi, the word he uses in this sentence at the beginning of chapter XIII, must have referred to a different game. Plus, I doubt most people would really agree with de brevitate vitae. It's the equivalent of "grind culture" but from the first century. Amusing and interesting but probably not congruent with now most people want to spend their lives. (No shame from me if you do want to live your life that way, but it should just be known that this is far from a neutral perspective.) For a more balanced view of otium (pleasure, relaxation, opposite of negotium, business), I'd recommend the letters of Pliny the Younger.
- ezekiel68 4y agoI dunno. Who is to say it is "too much" dynamic equivalence? Seems to me the grand intent of the quote is preserved for the greater mass of English readers.
- chucksmash 4y agoHa, I just re-read this page in this book this morning. The translation my book used instead of "chess-playing" was "draughts."
- WJW 4y ago“Chess is beautiful enough to waste your life for.” — Hans Ree
- dfrankle 4y agoWell, if you ask me, the ability to play chess well is the sign of someone who knows how to make the most of their free time!
- BashiBazouk 4y agoHeh...good quote. I was in chess club in Jr high, playing lots. One day I was about two thirds through a book on chess openings and had a major moment of self reflection: what the hell am I doing, this is really boring. Luckily for me I was introduced to white box original DnD about the same time and that solved that problem...
- geodel 4y agoHa, great quote! There is good movie in Hindi about wasted life of Chess obsessed protagonists. [1] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chess_Players_(film) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chess_Players_(film)
- teachrdan 4y agoOrthogonally, "Good at chess, bad at life."
- _a_a_a_ 4y agoThe definition of a gentleman - "a man who can play the bagpipes. But doesn't" (unknown attribution but I got it from a scotsman)
- cryptonector 4y agoA true Scotsman?
- patrickscoleman 4y agoThis makes me feel unreasonably better about my decision to stop trying to get better at chess. But I do miss those 3-day correspondence games with friends where you slowly get smoked by your better friends over weeks.
- rjbwork 4y agoMe and my friends play long term board games on boardgamearea.com now. Ticket to Ride, Roll for the Galaxy, It's a Wonderful World, and more. We've usually got at least 2, sometimes many more, going at a time. It's a good time.
- tiffanyh 4y agoYou could say this about anything ... like golf, etc.
- bsder 4y agoMorphy not Murphy.