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Counterpoint: We extend rights and protections to rare and beautiful things like the Great Barrier reef or endangered species despite their intelligence or bell

Counterpoint: We extend rights and protections to rare and beautiful things like the Great Barrier reef or endangered species despite their intelligence or belligerence. The minds AI has won so far were won in this way. Our pets, through breeding for characteristics that remind us of ourselves, won their rights through hearts and minds.

dougmwne 4y ago
People fought for environmental protection, so that is an extension of my point. An AI wins rights because it fights for itself or because it convinces other people to fight.
- weard_beard 4y ago
  I think there is a through-line... a thread within many arguments that would remind us of the Golden Rule. I like to imagine a vastly superior alien race which perceives the world in 6 dimensions. Is their truth, their perception, their stimuli, their physicality necessary for preserving human life? Does our relative pitiful might make our rights? This might help shape what law or societal changes we need to make for ourselves if we hope to become masters of our universe. Viewed in this lens, I think pets are a good analogy. AI is cute, useful, and to the degree it reflects our values and ourselves, we protect it above other life. Not always because it is intelligent and not because there was confrontation. One personal experience at a time, in a precarious and limited way we carved out additional protections largely through group dynamics, convention, and through mistakes, we evolved additional protections where needed.
  - dougmwne 4y ago
    This is a great perspective. Another thread here is that we often assign special importance to nonsentient human creation. Recall the outpouring of grief when Notre Dame burned. I believe it’s because it is a part of our collective humanity. All the more so these LLMs which are almost literally our collective humanity. Maybe in the future we will recognize them not as persons but as the towering cathedrals of our time.
  - webmaven 4y ago
    > Viewed in this lens, I think pets are a good analogy. AI is cute, useful, and to the degree it reflects our values and ourselves, we protect it above other life. Not always because it is intelligent and not because there was confrontation. Ideally, I'd prefer an analogy to wildlife rather than pets, as the roles between ourselves and AI may get reversed (so, "do unto others" etc.). But then again, so far we have a better track record protecting pets than protecting wildlife...

dougmwne 4y ago

People fought for environmental protection, so that is an extension of my point. An AI wins rights because it fights for itself or because it convinces other people to fight.

weard_beard 4y ago
I think there is a through-line... a thread within many arguments that would remind us of the Golden Rule. I like to imagine a vastly superior alien race which perceives the world in 6 dimensions. Is their truth, their perception, their stimuli, their physicality necessary for preserving human life? Does our relative pitiful might make our rights? This might help shape what law or societal changes we need to make for ourselves if we hope to become masters of our universe. Viewed in this lens, I think pets are a good analogy. AI is cute, useful, and to the degree it reflects our values and ourselves, we protect it above other life. Not always because it is intelligent and not because there was confrontation. One personal experience at a time, in a precarious and limited way we carved out additional protections largely through group dynamics, convention, and through mistakes, we evolved additional protections where needed.
- dougmwne 4y ago
  This is a great perspective. Another thread here is that we often assign special importance to nonsentient human creation. Recall the outpouring of grief when Notre Dame burned. I believe it’s because it is a part of our collective humanity. All the more so these LLMs which are almost literally our collective humanity. Maybe in the future we will recognize them not as persons but as the towering cathedrals of our time.
- webmaven 4y ago
  > Viewed in this lens, I think pets are a good analogy. AI is cute, useful, and to the degree it reflects our values and ourselves, we protect it above other life. Not always because it is intelligent and not because there was confrontation. Ideally, I'd prefer an analogy to wildlife rather than pets, as the roles between ourselves and AI may get reversed (so, "do unto others" etc.). But then again, so far we have a better track record protecting pets than protecting wildlife...