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True. In developed, rich countries with welfare state and feminism, women don't need individual men. Instead, they can rely on government and corporations to be

True. In developed, rich countries with welfare state and feminism, women don't need individual men. Instead, they can rely on government and corporations to be their protector & provider. When ecological pressures are relaxed, sexual selection (i.e. looks) becomes the dominant factor in mate selection. I suggest you read this blog: https://sirtyrionlannister.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/how-the-entire-modern-mating-framework-has-shifted-and-its-evolutionary-consequences/ https://sirtyrionlannister.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/how-the-...

kevviiinn 4y ago
What an absurdly sexist take, maybe women want to be with someone who is (actually, not 'nice guy') nice and doesn't think that money will get them laid?
- bilqis 4y ago
  While you’re right, and the guy is an incel, I want to mention that for longer periods of time women were forced into living with men just because it usually was the only way of survival. After emancipation, many men basically lost the single attractive trait they have - having a salary. So many men who are now experiencing problems with finding a partner now, say due to being a nasty/abusive/uninteresting/unintelligent/ugly, 80-100 years ago would be able to land a wife just by being the only person in the family who could provide. So in 2023, when they have to date equals, who are financially independent, they are experiencing “celibacy”.
  - bradlys 4y ago
    This is such tired, trite, and inaccurate take on the dating market. Talk to more young men. If you think 60% of young men are nasty/abusive/unintelligent/ugly to the point of not deserving any partners - you're clearly insane.
    - zamnos 4y ago
      We must be talking to a different 60% or have different opinions on what constitutes abuse then. Andrew Tate is plenty popular with a certain subset of boys.
      - roarcher 4y ago
        Like all meme influencers, Andrew Tate is popular with a subset of the subset of people who spend way too much time on the internet. If you think that's 60% of men/boys, then perhaps you're part of the subset that spends too much time on the internet. I've never heard anyone even mention his name IRL.
        zamnos 4y ago
        All the kids spend too much time online, so I'm not sure casting shade at them really gets us anywhere. If that's not the case for your kids, I'd love to hear how you're getting that to work. If you're not talking to boys about Andrew Tate because it hasn't come up (because it would be too cringe, as the kids say), don't worry, YouTube (reposts) have got you covered.
        roarcher 4y ago
        > All the kids spend too much time online, so I'm not sure casting shade at them really gets us anywhere. I'm not sure what you're talking about here. If anything I was "casting shade" at you for your remark about how terrible young men are. You're the one defending someone calling them "nasty/abusive/uninteresting/unintelligent/ugly". > If you're not talking to boys about Andrew Tate because it hasn't come up (because it would be too cringe, as the kids say), don't worry, YouTube (reposts) have got you covered. I talk to men in their early 20s to 40s mostly, the guys who go to my BJJ gym. I can promise you not one of them gives a shit about Andrew Tate's "HoW To bE aN aLpHa MaLe" grift. Half of them have probably never even heard of him.
        zamnos 4y ago
- esarbe 4y ago
  It's not sexist. It's a statistical observation about human behavior. Sure, there may be females that are just looking for a male who is nice. But in general they are looking for a male who is nice and good looking and has high societal status. Just as males are looking for females that are good looking and fertile. That's what all animals do. They try to maximize their reproductive success. Humans are animals. And even though we have contraceptives that negate the effect of the behavior, the underlying drive and mechanisms are still the same.
  - kevviiinn 4y ago
    What you're completely disregarding is the fact that nice males make for good fathers and helpful partners which is highly valuable. Your simplistic view on behavior results in a completely misunderstood and sexist viewpoint which only serves to reinforce patriarchal social constructs
    - esarbe 4y ago
      It doesn't matter if nice males make for better fathers if that doesn't improve reproductive success. Quite the contrary. When it comes to human societies; I don't buy that whole "patriarchal social constructs" thing. Society is a matter of constant negotiation between the sexes, not something that is forced from one sex onto the other and set in stone. To believe that females are oppressed by males is to believe that females are helpless and fragile and need to be protected. Females can very much take care of themselves and are just as strong a force in shaping society - if not more so - than males. Your simplistic view on reproductive behavior results in a completely misunderstood and sexist viewpoint which only serves to reinforce misunderstandings between the sexes.
      - kevviiinn 4y ago
        Females are not helpless or fragile but have definitely been historically oppressed especially in some highly religious societies Were women just voluntarily not voting in the US or what?

kevviiinn 4y ago

What an absurdly sexist take, maybe women want to be with someone who is (actually, not 'nice guy') nice and doesn't think that money will get them laid?

bilqis 4y ago
While you’re right, and the guy is an incel, I want to mention that for longer periods of time women were forced into living with men just because it usually was the only way of survival. After emancipation, many men basically lost the single attractive trait they have - having a salary. So many men who are now experiencing problems with finding a partner now, say due to being a nasty/abusive/uninteresting/unintelligent/ugly, 80-100 years ago would be able to land a wife just by being the only person in the family who could provide. So in 2023, when they have to date equals, who are financially independent, they are experiencing “celibacy”.
- bradlys 4y ago
  This is such tired, trite, and inaccurate take on the dating market. Talk to more young men. If you think 60% of young men are nasty/abusive/unintelligent/ugly to the point of not deserving any partners - you're clearly insane.
  - zamnos 4y ago
    We must be talking to a different 60% or have different opinions on what constitutes abuse then. Andrew Tate is plenty popular with a certain subset of boys.
    - roarcher 4y ago
      Like all meme influencers, Andrew Tate is popular with a subset of the subset of people who spend way too much time on the internet. If you think that's 60% of men/boys, then perhaps you're part of the subset that spends too much time on the internet. I've never heard anyone even mention his name IRL.
      - zamnos 4y ago
        All the kids spend too much time online, so I'm not sure casting shade at them really gets us anywhere. If that's not the case for your kids, I'd love to hear how you're getting that to work. If you're not talking to boys about Andrew Tate because it hasn't come up (because it would be too cringe, as the kids say), don't worry, YouTube (reposts) have got you covered.
        roarcher 4y ago
        > All the kids spend too much time online, so I'm not sure casting shade at them really gets us anywhere. I'm not sure what you're talking about here. If anything I was "casting shade" at you for your remark about how terrible young men are. You're the one defending someone calling them "nasty/abusive/uninteresting/unintelligent/ugly". > If you're not talking to boys about Andrew Tate because it hasn't come up (because it would be too cringe, as the kids say), don't worry, YouTube (reposts) have got you covered. I talk to men in their early 20s to 40s mostly, the guys who go to my BJJ gym. I can promise you not one of them gives a shit about Andrew Tate's "HoW To bE aN aLpHa MaLe" grift. Half of them have probably never even heard of him.
        zamnos 4y ago
esarbe 4y ago
It's not sexist. It's a statistical observation about human behavior. Sure, there may be females that are just looking for a male who is nice. But in general they are looking for a male who is nice and good looking and has high societal status. Just as males are looking for females that are good looking and fertile. That's what all animals do. They try to maximize their reproductive success. Humans are animals. And even though we have contraceptives that negate the effect of the behavior, the underlying drive and mechanisms are still the same.
- kevviiinn 4y ago
  What you're completely disregarding is the fact that nice males make for good fathers and helpful partners which is highly valuable. Your simplistic view on behavior results in a completely misunderstood and sexist viewpoint which only serves to reinforce patriarchal social constructs
  - esarbe 4y ago
    It doesn't matter if nice males make for better fathers if that doesn't improve reproductive success. Quite the contrary. When it comes to human societies; I don't buy that whole "patriarchal social constructs" thing. Society is a matter of constant negotiation between the sexes, not something that is forced from one sex onto the other and set in stone. To believe that females are oppressed by males is to believe that females are helpless and fragile and need to be protected. Females can very much take care of themselves and are just as strong a force in shaping society - if not more so - than males. Your simplistic view on reproductive behavior results in a completely misunderstood and sexist viewpoint which only serves to reinforce misunderstandings between the sexes.
    - kevviiinn 4y ago
      Females are not helpless or fragile but have definitely been historically oppressed especially in some highly religious societies Were women just voluntarily not voting in the US or what?