4 ms·

I recently discovered that I’m a slow metabolizer of caffeine. Via my raw 23andme data. https://you.23andme.com/tools/data/?query=rs762551 https://you.23andme.

by aantix 4y ago

I recently discovered that I’m a slow metabolizer of caffeine. Via my raw 23andme data. https://you.23andme.com/tools/data/?query=rs762551 https://you.23andme.com/tools/data/?query=rs762551 C/C genotype. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#CYP1A2_Genotype_report https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#C... Instead of coffee being a net positive, it actually takes caffeine 4X the time to process through my body and increases my cardiac event risk by 2X. I can drink a cup of coffee at 8am and it still impacts my sleep the following night. My blood pressure remains really elevated (20+ points for systolic) the entire day. All these decades I’ve been ingesting coffee thinking it’s a “net positive” - not for my genotype. When the reality is I sleep like shit, my blood pressure is through the roof, I feel awful for a day or two of drinking a single cup, and it all makes sense now. I miss my coffee kick, but the fallout from it all, I just don't think it's worth it anymore at this stage of my life.

_rs 4y ago
Are there any services like 23andme that are more strict when it comes to data privacy or that allow me complete ownership of the data? I would love this type of analysis even at a higher cost but I am scared of what might happen in the future to this data on me and children
- manimino 4y ago
  I have used Nebula. Did a group buy of the kits with several friends to obfuscate shipping address. Signed up via a protonmail address, and accessed the site only through VPN. Then deleted my data after downloading all of it. I believe it would be very difficult to tie my identity to my genome because of these steps.
  - nordsieck 4y ago
    > I believe it would be very difficult to tie my identity to my genome because of these steps. That probably depends on the closest relatively of yours that they have in their database. If you only have one sibling and they're in the database, you're probably boned no matter the precautions you take.
- aantix 4y ago
  Nebula is mentioned below for full DNA sequencing. I've used them for my son. As for analysis, you could try one of these. https://geneticgenie.org https://geneticgenie.org https://mthfrsupport.com https://mthfrsupport.com https://promethease.com https://promethease.com https://foundmyfitness.com/genetics https://foundmyfitness.com/genetics
- inetknght 4y ago
  > Are there any services like 23andme that are more strict when it comes to data privacy or that allow me complete ownership of the data? https://familytreedna.com https://familytreedna.com. I used to work for them > 2 years ago. 1. Order a Family Finder kit. When you get the kit but before submitting your swab, sign up for the account but opt-out of _all_ matching services. 2. Send your swab in. 3. When you get your results in (~6 weeks usually), download your raw data from the website. 4. Call their support line and ask for your data to be deleted.
  - ccvannorman 4y ago
    4. Call their support line and ask for your data to be deleted. I've been burned too many times in the past to ever believe this line, even if the people at the company are well intentioned.
- tylermac1 4y ago
  Health care providers can order genetic testing to help discover how your body metabolizes tons of things. I recently had it done and it illuminated an entire class of anti-depressant that has very little efficacy for me.
  - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
    Those tests are so limited in scope, I would not bother.
- moltar 4y ago
  I bought a kit on Amazon from a major provider. It was a Father’s Day promo. So it’s safe to assume at least half of purchases were gifts. And Amazon FBA does not share buyer data with the seller. Plus then I used all anonymous services, like junk email, VPN to sign up.
bick_nyers 4y ago
How does one figure this out using their DNA.txt file? Is there a Wiki for genes?
- manimino 4y ago
  Promethease (1) is a great site for doing this. You upload a genome (which they promise to delete), and download an HTML interactive report. The report spans thousands of studies, and it will tell you about any rare genetic disorders or interesting findings. The cost is about $18, one time, iirc. (1) https://promethease.com/ https://promethease.com/
  - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
    Do not stop at Promethease! I have been doing this for myself and others for the last 10 years. Promethease is great but misses several SNPs that are included in the raw data that may have an impact. Some other helpful websites: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/snp/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/snp/ https://www.uniprot.org/ https://www.uniprot.org/ https://www.snp-nexus.org/v4/ https://www.snp-nexus.org/v4/
- aantix 4y ago
  Take a look at this report. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#CYP1A2_Genotype_report https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#C... The newsletter above is fantastic BTW.
thisismyswamp 4y ago
Can't you drink one coffee in the morning? Also would like a source on the 2X cardiac event risk, couldn't find that in the linked article. Big if true!
- rednerrus 4y ago
  I have this genotype and if I have a mouthful of coffee at 8 am, I will be able to feel it at 1 AM the following morning.
- Acutulus 4y ago
  The enzyme responsible is CYP1A2 if I understand correctly. Here is the paper I found that supports increased risk of a specific cardiac event to slow metabolizers. I'm not the most adept at reading medical papers so I can't verify if it claims the risk is doubled, but I think it's possible. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 Coffee, CYP1A2 Genotype, and Risk of Myocardial Infarction Marilyn C. Cornelis, BSc; Ahmed El-Sohemy, PhD; Edmond K. Kabagambe, PhD; et al Hannia Campos, PhD JAMA. 2006;295(10):1135-1141. doi:10.1001/jama.295.10.1135
Balgair 4y ago
I did the same, but without any of the data here. Quitting caffeine got rid of my anxiety nearly entirely and my sleep quality was noticeably better. Literally changed my life. The 3 days of headaches were very bad. But worth it beyond anything for me. Open to questions if you have them, though it may take a bit to respond.
- melling 4y ago
  I imagine that simply lowering the dose over a few weeks before quitting might help with the headaches, for anyone else who decides to give up caffeine.
- CamelCaseName 4y ago
  I feel pretty bummed about these kinds of stories. I quit coffee for all of January, and I felt absolutely no difference. When I started again in February, apart from the first coffee feeling a little gross, I again felt no difference.
brailsafe 4y ago
Do your blood pressure problems gp away if you don't drink coffee? Have you blind tested this by getting someone to brew you something that may or may not be decaf?
FollowingTheDao 4y ago
CYP1A2 does not only metabolize caffeine, it is also involved in the metabolism of various endogenous substrates, including fatty acids, steroid hormones and vitamins. Focusing only on caffeine metabolism is one of the pitfalls of 23andme's reports. This gene change might mean you have higher cholesterol as well. To see everything this gene does check here: https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/P05177/entry https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/P05177/entry
- dangwhy 4y ago
  > This gene change might mean you have higher cholesterol as well. I have C/C in 23andme like gp and experience same caffeine effects. I have high cholesterol despite being active, fit and good diet. Would you know of any literature that might explain this in more layman terms. I had hard time reading the link you mentioned.
  - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
    Did this help? https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 CYP1A2 also metabolizes cholesterol so caffeine will increase your heart attack risk. And this is why genetics are crucial in understanding your dietary risks.
    - aantix 4y ago
      So for those that slowly metabolize caffeine, would it be prudent to take a statin?
      - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
        Probably not. It might be that you need the cholesterol to produce more steroid hormones. Statins not only stop you from making cholesterol but also CoQ10 as well. It would probably be best to keep a check on your oxidative stress because that is what most likely triggers heart disease, not just cholesterol alone. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6769522/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6769522/
dangwhy 4y ago
> it actually takes caffeine 4X the time I have C/C like you and feel effects of caffeine at night from 6 am coffee like you. I am really curious about 4x and 2x risk. I didn't seem to find that info in the link you posted.

by aantix 4y ago

_rs 4y ago

Are there any services like 23andme that are more strict when it comes to data privacy or that allow me complete ownership of the data? I would love this type of analysis even at a higher cost but I am scared of what might happen in the future to this data on me and children

manimino 4y ago
I have used Nebula. Did a group buy of the kits with several friends to obfuscate shipping address. Signed up via a protonmail address, and accessed the site only through VPN. Then deleted my data after downloading all of it. I believe it would be very difficult to tie my identity to my genome because of these steps.
- nordsieck 4y ago
  > I believe it would be very difficult to tie my identity to my genome because of these steps. That probably depends on the closest relatively of yours that they have in their database. If you only have one sibling and they're in the database, you're probably boned no matter the precautions you take.
aantix 4y ago
Nebula is mentioned below for full DNA sequencing. I've used them for my son. As for analysis, you could try one of these. https://geneticgenie.org https://geneticgenie.org https://mthfrsupport.com https://mthfrsupport.com https://promethease.com https://promethease.com https://foundmyfitness.com/genetics https://foundmyfitness.com/genetics
inetknght 4y ago
> Are there any services like 23andme that are more strict when it comes to data privacy or that allow me complete ownership of the data? https://familytreedna.com https://familytreedna.com. I used to work for them > 2 years ago. 1. Order a Family Finder kit. When you get the kit but before submitting your swab, sign up for the account but opt-out of _all_ matching services. 2. Send your swab in. 3. When you get your results in (~6 weeks usually), download your raw data from the website. 4. Call their support line and ask for your data to be deleted.
- ccvannorman 4y ago
  4. Call their support line and ask for your data to be deleted. I've been burned too many times in the past to ever believe this line, even if the people at the company are well intentioned.
tylermac1 4y ago
Health care providers can order genetic testing to help discover how your body metabolizes tons of things. I recently had it done and it illuminated an entire class of anti-depressant that has very little efficacy for me.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago
  Those tests are so limited in scope, I would not bother.
moltar 4y ago
I bought a kit on Amazon from a major provider. It was a Father’s Day promo. So it’s safe to assume at least half of purchases were gifts. And Amazon FBA does not share buyer data with the seller. Plus then I used all anonymous services, like junk email, VPN to sign up.

bick_nyers 4y ago

How does one figure this out using their DNA.txt file? Is there a Wiki for genes?

manimino 4y ago
Promethease (1) is a great site for doing this. You upload a genome (which they promise to delete), and download an HTML interactive report. The report spans thousands of studies, and it will tell you about any rare genetic disorders or interesting findings. The cost is about $18, one time, iirc. (1) https://promethease.com/ https://promethease.com/
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago
  Do not stop at Promethease! I have been doing this for myself and others for the last 10 years. Promethease is great but misses several SNPs that are included in the raw data that may have an impact. Some other helpful websites: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/snp/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/snp/ https://www.uniprot.org/ https://www.uniprot.org/ https://www.snp-nexus.org/v4/ https://www.snp-nexus.org/v4/
aantix 4y ago
Take a look at this report. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#CYP1A2_Genotype_report https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/#C... The newsletter above is fantastic BTW.

thisismyswamp 4y ago

Can't you drink one coffee in the morning? Also would like a source on the 2X cardiac event risk, couldn't find that in the linked article. Big if true!

rednerrus 4y ago
I have this genotype and if I have a mouthful of coffee at 8 am, I will be able to feel it at 1 AM the following morning.
Acutulus 4y ago
The enzyme responsible is CYP1A2 if I understand correctly. Here is the paper I found that supports increased risk of a specific cardiac event to slow metabolizers. I'm not the most adept at reading medical papers so I can't verify if it claims the risk is doubled, but I think it's possible. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 Coffee, CYP1A2 Genotype, and Risk of Myocardial Infarction Marilyn C. Cornelis, BSc; Ahmed El-Sohemy, PhD; Edmond K. Kabagambe, PhD; et al Hannia Campos, PhD JAMA. 2006;295(10):1135-1141. doi:10.1001/jama.295.10.1135

Balgair 4y ago

I did the same, but without any of the data here. Quitting caffeine got rid of my anxiety nearly entirely and my sleep quality was noticeably better. Literally changed my life. The 3 days of headaches were very bad. But worth it beyond anything for me. Open to questions if you have them, though it may take a bit to respond.

melling 4y ago
I imagine that simply lowering the dose over a few weeks before quitting might help with the headaches, for anyone else who decides to give up caffeine.
CamelCaseName 4y ago
I feel pretty bummed about these kinds of stories. I quit coffee for all of January, and I felt absolutely no difference. When I started again in February, apart from the first coffee feeling a little gross, I again felt no difference.

brailsafe 4y ago

Do your blood pressure problems gp away if you don't drink coffee? Have you blind tested this by getting someone to brew you something that may or may not be decaf?

FollowingTheDao 4y ago

CYP1A2 does not only metabolize caffeine, it is also involved in the metabolism of various endogenous substrates, including fatty acids, steroid hormones and vitamins. Focusing only on caffeine metabolism is one of the pitfalls of 23andme's reports. This gene change might mean you have higher cholesterol as well. To see everything this gene does check here: https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/P05177/entry https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/P05177/entry

dangwhy 4y ago
> This gene change might mean you have higher cholesterol as well. I have C/C in 23andme like gp and experience same caffeine effects. I have high cholesterol despite being active, fit and good diet. Would you know of any literature that might explain this in more layman terms. I had hard time reading the link you mentioned.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago
  Did this help? https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/202502 CYP1A2 also metabolizes cholesterol so caffeine will increase your heart attack risk. And this is why genetics are crucial in understanding your dietary risks.
  - aantix 4y ago
    So for those that slowly metabolize caffeine, would it be prudent to take a statin?
    - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
      Probably not. It might be that you need the cholesterol to produce more steroid hormones. Statins not only stop you from making cholesterol but also CoQ10 as well. It would probably be best to keep a check on your oxidative stress because that is what most likely triggers heart disease, not just cholesterol alone. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6769522/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6769522/

dangwhy 4y ago

> it actually takes caffeine 4X the time I have C/C like you and feel effects of caffeine at night from 6 am coffee like you. I am really curious about 4x and 2x risk. I didn't seem to find that info in the link you posted.