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That's not what I'm saying. It's that the people that were challenged chose to put out their thoughts in a way that welcomed it. If all you're there to do is me

by asim 4y ago

That's not what I'm saying. It's that the people that were challenged chose to put out their thoughts in a way that welcomed it. If all you're there to do is meet fellow developers and network is should be no issue. I never ended up in situations of devolving debate. Not once. But there's a lot of people who want to put out their strong thoughts without recourse. If you use a public platform to make bold statements which 50% of the world will oppose and it welcomes comments as twitter does then you should expect to be challenged. Again it's not about saying twitter is debate club. For the majority of people that's not the case for the outliers it is though and they don't like it.

lapcat 4y ago
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. If people want to debate, then they can go to a forum where people are debating. If they don't want to debate, then they can go to a forum where people aren't debating. Everyone gets what they want. That's good, isn't it?
- asim 4y ago
  Yes people should go to a place where healthy discussion is fostered. I'm not arguing against that. What I'm saying is there's a group of very vocal people who have left twitter to go start their own Mastodon communities because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter. If you're going to tweet publicly then it welcomes commentary, it's part of the system. If people want to put out their thoughts in an echo chamber then Mastodon is probably a better place for it.
  - lapcat 4y ago
    > What I'm saying is there's a group of very vocal people who have left twitter to go start their own Mastodon communities because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter. Do you have any evidence for this? The proximate cause of mass migration from Twitter to Mastodon was the acquisition of Twitter by Elon Musk.
    - asim 4y ago
      Elon is a catalyst because of the rise of hate speech and an inability to moderate it but it's created the opportunity to build these cult like communities elsewhere. I don't want to point to it because I'll receive a lot of backlash for that but it's happening.
      - lapcat 4y ago
        > because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter > because of the rise of hate speech and an inability to moderate it You're already changing your story. > it's created the opportunity to build these cult like communities elsewhere That's your characterization, which I do not agree with. Some would say that Musk himself has a cult-like following. In any case, Twitter and Mastodon have naturally segregated into pro-Musk and anti-Musk communities through no particular design by either side but simply as a result of the acquisition. Those who enjoy Musk Twitter have no reason to leave and join Mastodon, so of course there would be less "challenge" from them on Mastodon, but whose fault is that?
        asim 4y ago
        No I'm not changing my story. You mentioned Elon musk and I said it was a catalyst, not that it was the reason. There's a difference. A catalyst is an accelerant, it's not the source of a reaction. You're removing context by what's convenient for debate. The things you're saying are true but it's not the whole truth. People were unhappy on Twitter before Elon, for the reasons I mentioned. I'll leave it at that.
        lapcat 4y ago
        > People were unhappy on Twitter before Elon, for the reasons I mentioned. Yet they didn't leave until the Musk acquisition. Huh.
        asim 4y ago
        Again, it's about needing a catalyst. People suffer through much worse. What Elon did and the subsequent behaviour from alt-right uprising was enough not to just cause some people to leave but gave the vocal people with large followers a reason to voice their concerns and use it as a means to pull their audience to Mastodon. People would otherwise not have followed them and they'd essentially lose the audience they built. The cult leaders still need their followers. Without them, what are they? Crazy ranting folk.
  - N1ckFG 4y ago
    imo the "echo chamber" scenario would be if you only followed people from your local server, and also set your posts to only show there. If you set your posts to public and gather a couple hundred mutuals...I find the Mastodon 2023 experience turns out to be pleasantly similar to early '10s Twitter.

by asim 4y ago

lapcat 4y ago

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. If people want to debate, then they can go to a forum where people are debating. If they don't want to debate, then they can go to a forum where people aren't debating. Everyone gets what they want. That's good, isn't it?

asim 4y ago
Yes people should go to a place where healthy discussion is fostered. I'm not arguing against that. What I'm saying is there's a group of very vocal people who have left twitter to go start their own Mastodon communities because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter. If you're going to tweet publicly then it welcomes commentary, it's part of the system. If people want to put out their thoughts in an echo chamber then Mastodon is probably a better place for it.
- lapcat 4y ago
  > What I'm saying is there's a group of very vocal people who have left twitter to go start their own Mastodon communities because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter. Do you have any evidence for this? The proximate cause of mass migration from Twitter to Mastodon was the acquisition of Twitter by Elon Musk.
  - asim 4y ago
    Elon is a catalyst because of the rise of hate speech and an inability to moderate it but it's created the opportunity to build these cult like communities elsewhere. I don't want to point to it because I'll receive a lot of backlash for that but it's happening.
    - lapcat 4y ago
      > because they did not like their views being challenged on twitter > because of the rise of hate speech and an inability to moderate it You're already changing your story. > it's created the opportunity to build these cult like communities elsewhere That's your characterization, which I do not agree with. Some would say that Musk himself has a cult-like following. In any case, Twitter and Mastodon have naturally segregated into pro-Musk and anti-Musk communities through no particular design by either side but simply as a result of the acquisition. Those who enjoy Musk Twitter have no reason to leave and join Mastodon, so of course there would be less "challenge" from them on Mastodon, but whose fault is that?
      - asim 4y ago
        No I'm not changing my story. You mentioned Elon musk and I said it was a catalyst, not that it was the reason. There's a difference. A catalyst is an accelerant, it's not the source of a reaction. You're removing context by what's convenient for debate. The things you're saying are true but it's not the whole truth. People were unhappy on Twitter before Elon, for the reasons I mentioned. I'll leave it at that.
        lapcat 4y ago
        > People were unhappy on Twitter before Elon, for the reasons I mentioned. Yet they didn't leave until the Musk acquisition. Huh.
        asim 4y ago
        Again, it's about needing a catalyst. People suffer through much worse. What Elon did and the subsequent behaviour from alt-right uprising was enough not to just cause some people to leave but gave the vocal people with large followers a reason to voice their concerns and use it as a means to pull their audience to Mastodon. People would otherwise not have followed them and they'd essentially lose the audience they built. The cult leaders still need their followers. Without them, what are they? Crazy ranting folk.
- N1ckFG 4y ago
  imo the "echo chamber" scenario would be if you only followed people from your local server, and also set your posts to only show there. If you set your posts to public and gather a couple hundred mutuals...I find the Mastodon 2023 experience turns out to be pleasantly similar to early '10s Twitter.