5 ms·

For anyone else curious, the NTSB accident report (2014) about the same 2012 train derailment: https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/RAR14

by Brybry 4y ago

For anyone else curious, the NTSB accident report (2014) about the same 2012 train derailment: https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/RAR1401.pdf https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/...

userbinator 4y ago
It's worth reading just for figure 12 and the accompanying description immediately above it on the previous page.
- flangola7 4y ago
  >About 10:45 a.m., the Conrail hazardous materials risk manager; the CSXT hazardous materials manager; and the Gloucester County Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear, and Explosives team (CBRNE) lieutenant approached the wreckage by boat.38 Although none of these individuals wore respiratory protection, they closely inspected tank car valves and fittings. They acknowledged the accumulated frost on the tank cars and bridge equipment, thus confirming that the release of a compressed gas had occurred. Do these people not even care about their own well-being? I was stuck in traffic downwind of a semi fire once and it was like breathing death, I've carried an emergency CBRN respirator under my seat ever since. These responders have CBRN in their job title!
  - ck2 4y ago
    As we learned from covid "if you can't see it, it can't possibly hurt you, walk it off" ( /s )
  - userbinator 4y ago
    I was stuck in traffic downwind of a semi fire once and it was like breathing death Mixed material fires always smell horrible, and I haven't experienced vinyl chloride, but it sounds like it has a typical sweetish chlorocarbon smell, which probably won't trigger a "this might be toxic" reaction for many people. I'm more surprised that they didn't get overcome by the fumes, given that any remaining liquid would be boiling. Maybe they just held their breath...
    - flangola7 4y ago
      >it sounds like it has a typical sweetish chlorocarbon smell, which probably won't trigger a "this might be toxic" reaction for many people. I would expect the average resident to think that, but not a trained hazmat responder. That's like if I opened the TaylorSwift.mp3.exe in my spam folder and ran it as admin. I should know better.
  - jetbalsa 4y ago
    Due to lackluster repairs on the bridge, the control system was bypassed due not showing any signal that the bridge was locked. they did get out and inspect the "locks" but the guy who did it was only shown the locks years before the accident.
  - DoreenMichele 4y ago
    I worked at an insurance company for over 5 years. Reading medical records was part of the job and lots of my coworkers had prior work experience in the medical field. One of my teammates has been in EMS. And these people were shockingly oblivious to the health impacts of their immediate environment. I cleared out old papers from an empty cubicle next to mine because it was exacerbating my respiratory issues. The person whose cubicle was on the other side of that cubicle had been to see a doctor three times for some infection. After I removed the papers, their infection finally cleared up. They seemed to see zero connection between the two things. On another occasion, work crews came in to do work in an underutilized section covered in dust. My team was right next to all this and one of my coworkers was coughing all day, obviously in reaction. I said something sympathetic and she said "Oh, I guess that could be why I'm coughing. It hadn't occurred to me they might be related."
    - eurticket 4y ago
      You worked with people that didn't want to complain.
      - DoreenMichele 4y ago
        The person on the opposite side of the cubicle I cleaned out was my immediate lowest level boss. She had serious respiratory problems herself. If she realized the papers were making her sick, there's absolutely no reason she couldn't have decided to clean out that cubicle herself and she could have been more obvious about it than I was due to her supervisory position. She was responsible for the team. She could have taken responsibility for the "waste" of papers being left to rot in that empty cubicle. I did it more surreptitiously because I had no such authority. I spent a week or more getting forms and envelopes out of that cubicle whenever I needed forms and envelopes and quietly throwing out the ones so covered in dust and bent out of shape that they were no longer usable. Perhaps the other person simply didn't want to complain but my immediate boss went three times for antibiotics and then the last round finally worked "coincidentally" after I cleaned out the cubicle between hers and mine. If she knew the papers were why she was not getting better and just didn't want to complain, then she was too big of a doormat to deserve any kind of supervisory position at all. I doubt that's the explanation.
- 0cVlTeIATBs 4y ago
  Vinyl chloride has a 5ppm 15-minute exposure limit. This atmosphere was 500ppm. My first thought was that the odor would obviously signal danger and deter approach, but apparently it has "a pleasant odor at high concentrations." https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0658.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0658.html
jetbalsa 4y ago
Has a NTSB report been made yet for the current event?
- pininja 4y ago
  It will take at least months and usually years before their report is complete. We may see a couple initial statements or abstracts, but it’ll take a while to complete their in-depth report.
- hugh-avherald 4y ago
  Preliminary report has been released https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Documents/RRD23MR005%20East%20Palestine%20OH%20Prelim.pdf https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Documents/RRD23MR005%20E...
- AareyBaba 4y ago
  NTSB Media Availability: Norfolk Southern Freight Train Derailment https://youtu.be/5NN6gjWT7dI?t=222 https://youtu.be/5NN6gjWT7dI?t=222

by Brybry 4y ago

userbinator 4y ago

It's worth reading just for figure 12 and the accompanying description immediately above it on the previous page.

flangola7 4y ago
>About 10:45 a.m., the Conrail hazardous materials risk manager; the CSXT hazardous materials manager; and the Gloucester County Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear, and Explosives team (CBRNE) lieutenant approached the wreckage by boat.38 Although none of these individuals wore respiratory protection, they closely inspected tank car valves and fittings. They acknowledged the accumulated frost on the tank cars and bridge equipment, thus confirming that the release of a compressed gas had occurred. Do these people not even care about their own well-being? I was stuck in traffic downwind of a semi fire once and it was like breathing death, I've carried an emergency CBRN respirator under my seat ever since. These responders have CBRN in their job title!
- ck2 4y ago
  As we learned from covid "if you can't see it, it can't possibly hurt you, walk it off" ( /s )
- userbinator 4y ago
  I was stuck in traffic downwind of a semi fire once and it was like breathing death Mixed material fires always smell horrible, and I haven't experienced vinyl chloride, but it sounds like it has a typical sweetish chlorocarbon smell, which probably won't trigger a "this might be toxic" reaction for many people. I'm more surprised that they didn't get overcome by the fumes, given that any remaining liquid would be boiling. Maybe they just held their breath...
  - flangola7 4y ago
    >it sounds like it has a typical sweetish chlorocarbon smell, which probably won't trigger a "this might be toxic" reaction for many people. I would expect the average resident to think that, but not a trained hazmat responder. That's like if I opened the TaylorSwift.mp3.exe in my spam folder and ran it as admin. I should know better.
- jetbalsa 4y ago
  Due to lackluster repairs on the bridge, the control system was bypassed due not showing any signal that the bridge was locked. they did get out and inspect the "locks" but the guy who did it was only shown the locks years before the accident.
- DoreenMichele 4y ago
  I worked at an insurance company for over 5 years. Reading medical records was part of the job and lots of my coworkers had prior work experience in the medical field. One of my teammates has been in EMS. And these people were shockingly oblivious to the health impacts of their immediate environment. I cleared out old papers from an empty cubicle next to mine because it was exacerbating my respiratory issues. The person whose cubicle was on the other side of that cubicle had been to see a doctor three times for some infection. After I removed the papers, their infection finally cleared up. They seemed to see zero connection between the two things. On another occasion, work crews came in to do work in an underutilized section covered in dust. My team was right next to all this and one of my coworkers was coughing all day, obviously in reaction. I said something sympathetic and she said "Oh, I guess that could be why I'm coughing. It hadn't occurred to me they might be related."
  - eurticket 4y ago
    You worked with people that didn't want to complain.
    - DoreenMichele 4y ago
      The person on the opposite side of the cubicle I cleaned out was my immediate lowest level boss. She had serious respiratory problems herself. If she realized the papers were making her sick, there's absolutely no reason she couldn't have decided to clean out that cubicle herself and she could have been more obvious about it than I was due to her supervisory position. She was responsible for the team. She could have taken responsibility for the "waste" of papers being left to rot in that empty cubicle. I did it more surreptitiously because I had no such authority. I spent a week or more getting forms and envelopes out of that cubicle whenever I needed forms and envelopes and quietly throwing out the ones so covered in dust and bent out of shape that they were no longer usable. Perhaps the other person simply didn't want to complain but my immediate boss went three times for antibiotics and then the last round finally worked "coincidentally" after I cleaned out the cubicle between hers and mine. If she knew the papers were why she was not getting better and just didn't want to complain, then she was too big of a doormat to deserve any kind of supervisory position at all. I doubt that's the explanation.
0cVlTeIATBs 4y ago
Vinyl chloride has a 5ppm 15-minute exposure limit. This atmosphere was 500ppm. My first thought was that the odor would obviously signal danger and deter approach, but apparently it has "a pleasant odor at high concentrations." https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0658.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0658.html

jetbalsa 4y ago

Has a NTSB report been made yet for the current event?

pininja 4y ago
It will take at least months and usually years before their report is complete. We may see a couple initial statements or abstracts, but it’ll take a while to complete their in-depth report.
hugh-avherald 4y ago
Preliminary report has been released https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Documents/RRD23MR005%20East%20Palestine%20OH%20Prelim.pdf https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Documents/RRD23MR005%20E...
AareyBaba 4y ago
NTSB Media Availability: Norfolk Southern Freight Train Derailment https://youtu.be/5NN6gjWT7dI?t=222 https://youtu.be/5NN6gjWT7dI?t=222