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So just to be clear: you want to discuss a smartphone, in a vacuum, completely ignoring what - barring a few select Android phones - effectively sets the bar fo

So just to be clear: you want to discuss a smartphone, in a vacuum, completely ignoring what - barring a few select Android phones - effectively sets the bar for the industry. It’s not “fanbois”, it’s just reality. HN isn’t the one that needs to get a grip here.

jimnotgym 4y ago
People could compare the Nokia to comparable phones perhaps? There are other repairable phones available, although I don't recall any this cheap? In other news my Ford is not as comfortable as your Rolls Royce, and my Sekonda watch is not going to last like your Rolex....
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Klonoar 4y ago
  >People could compare the Nokia to comparable phones perhaps? They could! And in fact, do. OP, however, is complaining about the existence of the Apple comparison, which is simply unavoidable. I'm just responding that instead of complaining about it, move on to the discussions that float your boat.
- mNovak 4y ago
  >> and my Sekonda watch is not going to last like your Rolex... No one tell my Timex! This thing's running for life
mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
Since when has Apple ever made an easily repairable budget anything? This is a niche in which Apple is non existent.
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
  Since last year their phones have best ranking https://www.ifixit.com/smartphone-repairability https://www.ifixit.com/smartphone-repairability (Yes Fairphone have excellent score too, but they are basically ancient)
  - mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
    Not sure how you read that as the best ranking. Only among flagship phones, which is a market where repairability is largely an afterthought. Fairphone is a repairable budget phone. You can't compare budget to flagship on performance or modernity of the hardware. That makes no sense.
    - dzhiurgis 4y ago
      TBF Fairphone will be far likely to break over the isolated iPhone 13. Add the lack of software support and it’s far more expensive to own. All that said, bend it whichever way you like and this Nokia’s value is impossible to beat.
dartharva 4y ago
The iPhone does not set any bar for budget phones. Irrelevant.
- Klonoar 4y ago
  It's not irrelevant. :) Buying a "budget" phone that has no guarantee of long term parts availability, OS upgrades, etc is certainly worth comparing to Apple's lowest cost devices factored out over the sheer number of years they offer support/service for. I appreciate the aspect of right-to-repair on this device and I'm not saying the device shouldn't exist, but it's the height of absurdity to think it wouldn't get compared to Apple's devices at some point in the conversation. Hell, even conversations about the Fairphone end up drawing these same comparisons since Apple's recycling program is pretty good.
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    That's one way of looking at it. On the other side of the coin, all Apple devices have an expiry date. Many Android phones unlock their bootloader and enable community support after the vendor has thrown in the towel. Nothing similar exists on iOS, and it's a damn shame - it forces Apple to depreciate usable hardware. In a world where reuse and reduction is preferable to recycling, Apple should stop pretending like it's free recycling program is a replacement for serviceable design and open hardware. Until Apple stops being a necessary step of the recycling process, recycling iPhones is no easier than disposing of Asbestos. People (rightfully) get pissed when others shit on camera-shy companies like Nokia or Dell trying something repair-friendly. You're like the person who's saying that nobody should buy the Raspberry Pi because your 1u rackmount has better performance-per-dollar. You're not wrong, but it's an apples-to-oranges product comparison.
eptcyka 4y ago
Right, when discussing any car, no discussion can possibly be good unless it includes the Tesla model s, regardless of budget or applicability.
mNovak 4y ago
Maybe I'm a luddite with my 2017 phone, but what's meaningfully changed in smartphones in the past 5yrs that Apple is setting the bar on? (Besides pushing screens to the bezel, and the cameras multiplying)
dang 4y ago
Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. It's tedious, not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- Klonoar 4y ago
  I'm pointing out that the comment is inviting a flame war, and that it's natural to compare things to the elephant in the room.
  - dang 4y ago
    The GP was obvious flamebait and I replied to it with a scolding. But your comment was also flamebait. It's important not to reply with more of the same—that's how we get a downward spiral. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=downward%20spiral%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

jimnotgym 4y ago

People could compare the Nokia to comparable phones perhaps? There are other repairable phones available, although I don't recall any this cheap? In other news my Ford is not as comfortable as your Rolls Royce, and my Sekonda watch is not going to last like your Rolex....

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Klonoar 4y ago
>People could compare the Nokia to comparable phones perhaps? They could! And in fact, do. OP, however, is complaining about the existence of the Apple comparison, which is simply unavoidable. I'm just responding that instead of complaining about it, move on to the discussions that float your boat.
mNovak 4y ago
>> and my Sekonda watch is not going to last like your Rolex... No one tell my Timex! This thing's running for life

mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago

Since when has Apple ever made an easily repairable budget anything? This is a niche in which Apple is non existent.

dzhiurgis 4y ago
Since last year their phones have best ranking https://www.ifixit.com/smartphone-repairability https://www.ifixit.com/smartphone-repairability (Yes Fairphone have excellent score too, but they are basically ancient)
- mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
  Not sure how you read that as the best ranking. Only among flagship phones, which is a market where repairability is largely an afterthought. Fairphone is a repairable budget phone. You can't compare budget to flagship on performance or modernity of the hardware. That makes no sense.
  - dzhiurgis 4y ago
    TBF Fairphone will be far likely to break over the isolated iPhone 13. Add the lack of software support and it’s far more expensive to own. All that said, bend it whichever way you like and this Nokia’s value is impossible to beat.

dartharva 4y ago

The iPhone does not set any bar for budget phones. Irrelevant.

Klonoar 4y ago
It's not irrelevant. :) Buying a "budget" phone that has no guarantee of long term parts availability, OS upgrades, etc is certainly worth comparing to Apple's lowest cost devices factored out over the sheer number of years they offer support/service for. I appreciate the aspect of right-to-repair on this device and I'm not saying the device shouldn't exist, but it's the height of absurdity to think it wouldn't get compared to Apple's devices at some point in the conversation. Hell, even conversations about the Fairphone end up drawing these same comparisons since Apple's recycling program is pretty good.
- smoldesu 4y ago
  That's one way of looking at it. On the other side of the coin, all Apple devices have an expiry date. Many Android phones unlock their bootloader and enable community support after the vendor has thrown in the towel. Nothing similar exists on iOS, and it's a damn shame - it forces Apple to depreciate usable hardware. In a world where reuse and reduction is preferable to recycling, Apple should stop pretending like it's free recycling program is a replacement for serviceable design and open hardware. Until Apple stops being a necessary step of the recycling process, recycling iPhones is no easier than disposing of Asbestos. People (rightfully) get pissed when others shit on camera-shy companies like Nokia or Dell trying something repair-friendly. You're like the person who's saying that nobody should buy the Raspberry Pi because your 1u rackmount has better performance-per-dollar. You're not wrong, but it's an apples-to-oranges product comparison.

eptcyka 4y ago

Right, when discussing any car, no discussion can possibly be good unless it includes the Tesla model s, regardless of budget or applicability.

mNovak 4y ago

Maybe I'm a luddite with my 2017 phone, but what's meaningfully changed in smartphones in the past 5yrs that Apple is setting the bar on? (Besides pushing screens to the bezel, and the cameras multiplying)

dang 4y ago

Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. It's tedious, not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Klonoar 4y ago
I'm pointing out that the comment is inviting a flame war, and that it's natural to compare things to the elephant in the room.
- dang 4y ago
  The GP was obvious flamebait and I replied to it with a scolding. But your comment was also flamebait. It's important not to reply with more of the same—that's how we get a downward spiral. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=downward%20spiral%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...