9 ms·

I don't see such grand stratagems as being a likely explanation. It seems more likely that a bunch of dorks are running around unsupervised trying their best to

I don't see such grand stratagems as being a likely explanation. It seems more likely that a bunch of dorks are running around unsupervised trying their best to make lemonade with whatever budgets they are given as nobody can realistically manage AI researches. Or at least, it seems that much like in political governance, events are suddenly outpacing the ability of corporate to react. In the case of OpenAI it is a "nudge humanity into a more wholesome direction" because a lot of them went on an acid fueled toxic affective altruism bender. And in this case it is "release all the things while Zuck is still obsessed with VR --for science!". I like this other group better. But it is disturbing that it can stop at any moment. Probably why they are doing it, while they still can.

fwlr 4y ago
The researchers and engineers and other assorted dorks who built it weren’t thinking about moats, for sure, I agree with you there. But I guarantee you that the metaphor of medieval warfare was on the minds of the executives and legal team deciding whether to let the team release their work in this way.
titzer 4y ago
They almost certainly spent at least a few million dollars on this research project. Hard to say when the decision was made to open source this (from the outset or after it started showing results), but the decision was conscious and calculated. Nothing this high-profile is going to escape the strategic decision making processes of upper management.
mliker 4y ago
this is a pretty biased and uninformed opinion. Pretty condescending to call it a "bunch of dorks...running around unsupervised."
- recuter 4y ago
  I don't know what my bias is supposed to be but I called them dorks affectionately for one. The other replies are literally arguing that they are very extremely supervised where as I am speculating they are just eager to share their work for the right reasons and the eye of Sauron has yet to turn upon them. Inside knowledge I never claimed. Anything else I can help you with today? :)
  - rcpt 4y ago
    > I called them dorks affectionately Never in my life have I seen that word used affectionately
    - vidarh 4y ago
      I have seen that many times, as well as seeing people use it about themselves.
    - sebastiennight 4y ago
      I think Noah Kagan's blog is literally called "OK Dork", and I always assumed the title was self-deprecating (in a fun/positive way) rather than negative.
    - drusepth 4y ago
      Geek, nerd, and dork can all be used positively/affectionately. I know I've called myself and friends all of the above on many occasions.
    - alibero 4y ago
      As one of the unsupervised dorks working on LLMs at Meta (not one of the authors here) I took it in a positive way :)
      - recuter 4y ago
        Thank you for your service meatbag <3
- tantalor 4y ago
  Check out https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Not sure how calling out comment as "biased", "uninformed" or "condescending" is helping.
visarga 4y ago
> It seems more likely that a bunch of dorks are running around unsupervised trying their best to make lemonade with whatever budgets they are given Probably not, Zuck is announcing it.
- recuter 4y ago
  Today we're releasing a new state-of-the-art AI large language model called LLaMA designed to help researchers advance their work. LLMs have shown a lot of promise in generating text, having conversations, summarizing written material, and more complicated tasks like solving math theorems or predicting protein structures. Meta is committed to this open model of research and we'll make our new model available to the AI research community. I don't know what that means or if he even wrote/read it tbh. I hope it literally just means Meta is actually committed to this open model of research (for now). Maybe he is being a Machiavellian moat filler, I stand corrected. I think/hope that they don't really have a plan to counter OpenAI yet because I am afraid this attitude won't last once they do and this stuff has recently started moving quickly.
  - ahati 4y ago
    It is to please the shareholders. Now shareholder can know that Meta can compete with GPT3.
    - ttul 4y ago
      100%. This kind of announcement is for the street. Investors need to be reassured that Meta is keeping up with the cool AI stuff over at Google and Microsoft. A release like this will cause a flurry of downstream news coverage. I’m sure they are hoping that the model will be picked up by researchers doing interesting things who might further generate good coverage. And, yes, it fills the moat.
vineyardmike 4y ago
I think there is definitely a component of competition here. Facebook has no real way to monetize this (eg they won’t release an api a la OpenAI and they don’t own a search engine). Since they can’t monetize it… why not provide a bit of kindling to lower the barrier for everyone else to compete with your competitors. This strategy is called “commodize your complement”. If Facebook makes it easier to develop a google alternative, especially by doing something that doesn’t hurt them, then they just weakened a competitor. See Facebook releasing datasets for mapping. Think of the panic ChatGPT caused Google. It only cost a few Million to train but it’s probably costing Google more than that already.
- naasking 4y ago
  Facebook maybe can't make money from it, but they arguably could save money from it, for instance in automating some fact checking and moderation activities that they currently spend quite a bit of money on.
  - sclarisse 4y ago
    If you’re going to ask an AI to do fact checking with today’s technology, I would urge you to start by asking the AI a simple test question: Which is heavier? A pound of feathers or two pounds of lead?
    - elbear 4y ago
      Do you have an explanation for why it fails on this question?
      - panarky 4y ago
        Why assume it fails? ChatGPT: "One pound of feathers and two pounds of lead weigh the same, which is one pound or 16 ounces. The difference is in their volume, where a pound of feathers takes up more space than two pounds of lead. This is because the density of feathers is much less than that of lead, so even though the weight is the same, the amount of space they occupy is quite different."

fwlr 4y ago

The researchers and engineers and other assorted dorks who built it weren’t thinking about moats, for sure, I agree with you there. But I guarantee you that the metaphor of medieval warfare was on the minds of the executives and legal team deciding whether to let the team release their work in this way.

titzer 4y ago

They almost certainly spent at least a few million dollars on this research project. Hard to say when the decision was made to open source this (from the outset or after it started showing results), but the decision was conscious and calculated. Nothing this high-profile is going to escape the strategic decision making processes of upper management.

mliker 4y ago

this is a pretty biased and uninformed opinion. Pretty condescending to call it a "bunch of dorks...running around unsupervised."

recuter 4y ago
I don't know what my bias is supposed to be but I called them dorks affectionately for one. The other replies are literally arguing that they are very extremely supervised where as I am speculating they are just eager to share their work for the right reasons and the eye of Sauron has yet to turn upon them. Inside knowledge I never claimed. Anything else I can help you with today? :)
- rcpt 4y ago
  > I called them dorks affectionately Never in my life have I seen that word used affectionately
  - vidarh 4y ago
    I have seen that many times, as well as seeing people use it about themselves.
  - sebastiennight 4y ago
    I think Noah Kagan's blog is literally called "OK Dork", and I always assumed the title was self-deprecating (in a fun/positive way) rather than negative.
  - drusepth 4y ago
    Geek, nerd, and dork can all be used positively/affectionately. I know I've called myself and friends all of the above on many occasions.
  - alibero 4y ago
    As one of the unsupervised dorks working on LLMs at Meta (not one of the authors here) I took it in a positive way :)
    - recuter 4y ago
      Thank you for your service meatbag <3
tantalor 4y ago
Check out https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Not sure how calling out comment as "biased", "uninformed" or "condescending" is helping.

visarga 4y ago

> It seems more likely that a bunch of dorks are running around unsupervised trying their best to make lemonade with whatever budgets they are given Probably not, Zuck is announcing it.

recuter 4y ago
Today we're releasing a new state-of-the-art AI large language model called LLaMA designed to help researchers advance their work. LLMs have shown a lot of promise in generating text, having conversations, summarizing written material, and more complicated tasks like solving math theorems or predicting protein structures. Meta is committed to this open model of research and we'll make our new model available to the AI research community. I don't know what that means or if he even wrote/read it tbh. I hope it literally just means Meta is actually committed to this open model of research (for now). Maybe he is being a Machiavellian moat filler, I stand corrected. I think/hope that they don't really have a plan to counter OpenAI yet because I am afraid this attitude won't last once they do and this stuff has recently started moving quickly.
- ahati 4y ago
  It is to please the shareholders. Now shareholder can know that Meta can compete with GPT3.
  - ttul 4y ago
    100%. This kind of announcement is for the street. Investors need to be reassured that Meta is keeping up with the cool AI stuff over at Google and Microsoft. A release like this will cause a flurry of downstream news coverage. I’m sure they are hoping that the model will be picked up by researchers doing interesting things who might further generate good coverage. And, yes, it fills the moat.

vineyardmike 4y ago

I think there is definitely a component of competition here. Facebook has no real way to monetize this (eg they won’t release an api a la OpenAI and they don’t own a search engine). Since they can’t monetize it… why not provide a bit of kindling to lower the barrier for everyone else to compete with your competitors. This strategy is called “commodize your complement”. If Facebook makes it easier to develop a google alternative, especially by doing something that doesn’t hurt them, then they just weakened a competitor. See Facebook releasing datasets for mapping. Think of the panic ChatGPT caused Google. It only cost a few Million to train but it’s probably costing Google more than that already.

naasking 4y ago
Facebook maybe can't make money from it, but they arguably could save money from it, for instance in automating some fact checking and moderation activities that they currently spend quite a bit of money on.
- sclarisse 4y ago
  If you’re going to ask an AI to do fact checking with today’s technology, I would urge you to start by asking the AI a simple test question: Which is heavier? A pound of feathers or two pounds of lead?
  - elbear 4y ago
    Do you have an explanation for why it fails on this question?
    - panarky 4y ago
      Why assume it fails? ChatGPT: "One pound of feathers and two pounds of lead weigh the same, which is one pound or 16 ounces. The difference is in their volume, where a pound of feathers takes up more space than two pounds of lead. This is because the density of feathers is much less than that of lead, so even though the weight is the same, the amount of space they occupy is quite different."