4 ms·

At this point it's irresponsible for browsers not to come with ad blocking preinstalled.

freediver 4y ago
You are correct ads have become popups of late 90s. Yet, very few browsers do, as most of them depend directly or indirectly on ad revenue. AFAIK only Orion browser [1] comes with full 1st party and 3rd party ad and tracker blocking, by default. [1] https://browser.kagi.com https://browser.kagi.com
- Eisenstein 4y ago
  Brave browser is literally built to block ads.
  - freediver 4y ago
    Except that it does not block first party ads by default (and also makes money by serving their own first party ads to users).
    - Eisenstein 4y ago
      I don't see any ads. You can turn them off.
      - freediver 4y ago
        You can not say a browser is built to block ads when showing ads is literally how it makes money. You maybe turned it off, but most people didn't. If everybody turned it off, it would not have a revenue stream.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
        Eisenstein 4y ago
        > You can not say a browser is built to block ads when showing ads is literally how it makes money. Sure I can: It was built to block ads. You have to tell it to do so in a way that blocks "all of them" otherwise it just blocks the terrible/annoying/malicious ones.
  - kerkeslager 4y ago
    Brave is directly financed by advertisers.
    - Eisenstein 4y ago
      So? It still blocks ads.
      - kerkeslager 4y ago
        Sure, but do they also not collect any analytics for their ads? Will that last through a financial crisis if advertisers offer them more money? Will it last if they gain market dominance? If their money comes from advertisers and not users, they serve advertisers and not users. Supporting them as a temporary solution just means if they succeed we have all the same problems when the same incentives come into play.
        Eisenstein 4y ago
        > Sure, but do they also not collect any analytics for their ads? Configurable. > Will that last through a financial crisis if advertisers offer them more money? Will Brazil win the 2090 world cup? I'm not sure I get your point... > Supporting them as a temporary solution just means if they succeed we have all the same problems when the same incentives come into play. Internet services are run by ads. Unless we can transfer to a model which is publicly funded or subscription based (even free software needs to pay for servers and employees -- the money has to come from somewhere) then the best we can hope for is an ad-funded service which allows you enough control to turn everything off if you want to. Do you have a better solution and are you willing to start working on it? Otherwise, you are making 'perfect' the enemy of 'good'.
        kerkeslager 4y ago
        > Configurable. Remember when you responded to a post about blocking ads by default? > Internet services are run by ads. Unless we can transfer to a model which is publicly funded or subscription based (even free software needs to pay for servers and employees -- the money has to come from somewhere) then the best we can hope for is an ad-funded service which allows you enough control to turn everything off if you want to. Now we get to the point: you support ads, so you aren't actually committed to getting rid of them. The internet existed before internet advertising, and the kinds of websites people built for intrinsic reasons rather than for money were far superior. If Facebook et al disappeared completely the world would be a better place. There is not a shortage of content, there is a shortage of filterability created by low-effort garbage funded by ads. If people aren't willing to pay for something, it's because it's not that great. Patreon shows that some people are willing to just make donations for free content. And incidentally, Patreon-supported content tends to be higher-quality because they're serving donors, not advertisers. We don't need ads. Ads are a blight on humanity which provides negative value. > Do you have a better solution and are you willing to start working on it? You mean the < 10 lines of code necessary to have an ad blocker installed by default? > Otherwise, you are making 'perfect' the enemy of 'good'. Brave is not "good". It's literally no different in any way from a browser which supports adblocking extensions.

You are correct ads have become popups of late 90s. Yet, very few browsers do, as most of them depend directly or indirectly on ad revenue. AFAIK only Orion browser [1] comes with full 1st party and 3rd party ad and tracker blocking, by default. [1] https://browser.kagi.com https://browser.kagi.com

Eisenstein 4y ago
Brave browser is literally built to block ads.
- freediver 4y ago
  Except that it does not block first party ads by default (and also makes money by serving their own first party ads to users).
  - Eisenstein 4y ago
    I don't see any ads. You can turn them off.
    - freediver 4y ago
      You can not say a browser is built to block ads when showing ads is literally how it makes money. You maybe turned it off, but most people didn't. If everybody turned it off, it would not have a revenue stream.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - Eisenstein 4y ago
        > You can not say a browser is built to block ads when showing ads is literally how it makes money. Sure I can: It was built to block ads. You have to tell it to do so in a way that blocks "all of them" otherwise it just blocks the terrible/annoying/malicious ones.
- kerkeslager 4y ago
  Brave is directly financed by advertisers.
  - Eisenstein 4y ago
    So? It still blocks ads.
    - kerkeslager 4y ago
      Sure, but do they also not collect any analytics for their ads? Will that last through a financial crisis if advertisers offer them more money? Will it last if they gain market dominance? If their money comes from advertisers and not users, they serve advertisers and not users. Supporting them as a temporary solution just means if they succeed we have all the same problems when the same incentives come into play.
      - Eisenstein 4y ago
        > Sure, but do they also not collect any analytics for their ads? Configurable. > Will that last through a financial crisis if advertisers offer them more money? Will Brazil win the 2090 world cup? I'm not sure I get your point... > Supporting them as a temporary solution just means if they succeed we have all the same problems when the same incentives come into play. Internet services are run by ads. Unless we can transfer to a model which is publicly funded or subscription based (even free software needs to pay for servers and employees -- the money has to come from somewhere) then the best we can hope for is an ad-funded service which allows you enough control to turn everything off if you want to. Do you have a better solution and are you willing to start working on it? Otherwise, you are making 'perfect' the enemy of 'good'.
        kerkeslager 4y ago
        > Configurable. Remember when you responded to a post about blocking ads by default? > Internet services are run by ads. Unless we can transfer to a model which is publicly funded or subscription based (even free software needs to pay for servers and employees -- the money has to come from somewhere) then the best we can hope for is an ad-funded service which allows you enough control to turn everything off if you want to. Now we get to the point: you support ads, so you aren't actually committed to getting rid of them. The internet existed before internet advertising, and the kinds of websites people built for intrinsic reasons rather than for money were far superior. If Facebook et al disappeared completely the world would be a better place. There is not a shortage of content, there is a shortage of filterability created by low-effort garbage funded by ads. If people aren't willing to pay for something, it's because it's not that great. Patreon shows that some people are willing to just make donations for free content. And incidentally, Patreon-supported content tends to be higher-quality because they're serving donors, not advertisers. We don't need ads. Ads are a blight on humanity which provides negative value. > Do you have a better solution and are you willing to start working on it? You mean the < 10 lines of code necessary to have an ad blocker installed by default? > Otherwise, you are making 'perfect' the enemy of 'good'. Brave is not "good". It's literally no different in any way from a browser which supports adblocking extensions.