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For each "wave" of crypto techs (currencies, smart contracts, nfts), I've thought to myself, "That's a neat primitive! I wonder what useful thing people will b

For each "wave" of crypto techs (currencies, smart contracts, nfts), I've thought to myself, "That's a neat primitive! I wonder what useful thing people will build on it!" And each time, I've continued to wonder more or less indefinitely as... pretty much nothing useful comes out of it. Lots of scams, speculation, and investor money, but nothing I'd actually want to use. The one I'm still most hopeful for is smart contracts. Maybe the only thing preventing people from building useful things on them has been high costs. Maybe all they really need is a widely-used, cheaper smart contract system like Base! That said, I'm not terribly hopeful at this point.

joyfylbanana 4y ago
I still use only BTC and the reason why I use it is not because it is so great technically, I just don't like fiat.
- infecto 4y ago
  BTC is fiat right?
  - Veen 4y ago
    No, fiat currencies are backed by states and central banks. BTC has some of the qualities of fiat currency—no commodity backing, etc—but it's not usually classified as one.
    - wonderwonder 4y ago
      If it's declared legal tender by government declaration or fiat, it's fiat currency. Btc is fiat currency in el Salvador
      - Veen 4y ago
        It's legal tender in El Salvador. Whether that makes it a fiat currency is a matter of definitions, so not really worth quibbling about.
        wonderwonder 4y ago
        I'm not quibbling. It's fiat currency in El Salvador by any definition.
        ashwagary 4y ago
        Fiat money is created by decree without effort. Bitcoin is not "fiat" no matter who adopts it.
  - hgsgm 4y ago
    It's decentralized fiat, so sort of hybrid between fiat and hard.
  - kylebenzle1 4y ago
    BTC (one version of "Bitcoin") is a digital ponzi scheme for morons controlled by the for profit companies Blockstream and Bitfinx. BCH, the original version of Bitcoin is a Peer-to-Peer Digital Cash network, a replacement of government "fiat" currency.
  - wonderwonder 4y ago
    It's fiat in a very limited number of countries. It's fungible.
j0hnyl 4y ago
The costs of building on smart contracts are really not that high. Dirt cheap on some chains. Anyway, I do love the crypto ecosystem, because I find it fun, but I don't really support the narrative that everyone should be onboarded onto it in some way or form. I'm much happier if it stays a toy for the nerds that like to play with it. There's also an element of counterculture to it as well. I also think there are some positive ripple-effects... I think there are people who have become more financially literate as a result of their interest in crypto and it's cool that adjacent technologies like IPFS have gotten more attention as a result.
chx 4y ago
Smart contracts have a serious problem: contracts are only as strong as the enforcement behind them are. If you peel back all the layers, at the end of the day, real world contracts have meaning because of the monopoly on violence by the state. In much simpler terms, if I contract with you to buy something and you do not deliver, what happens then?
- SkyMarshal 4y ago
  You don't have a choice not to deliver in a smart contract. You cryptographically commit to the contract the maximum amount you may have to pay out, and you can't reneg or claw it back in any way. When the contract settles, the code determines the payout automatically without further input from the counter-parties. You can't withhold anything. There are no capital calls, margin calls, or anything like that. The smart contract is basically an escrow service. There are two problems though: 1. For long-duration contracts, tying up that much capital is considered capital-inefficient by traditional financial system standards. It's tied up for a duration it could be making interest elsewhere, even if just the risk-free rate with T-bills or LIBOR. Conversely, it is very redundant and guarantees counterparty performance, there's no chance of a breach of contract. 2. Smart contracts that are settled by real-world data or events are subject to the oracle problem - you must trust both the data source, and its transmission onto the blockchain. If the oracle performing that function provides incorrect data, either accidentally or maliciously, it will cause the smart contract to settle incorrectly, and there's no recourse or claw back possible. So smart contracts are not without their challenges, but they don't depend on real world law enforcement to guarantee settlement.
  - LiquidSky 4y ago
    >and you can't reneg or claw it back in any way >it will cause the smart contract to settle incorrectly, and there's no recourse or claw back possible. "Smart" contracts are subject to applicable contract law, and are susceptible to all normal causes for invalidating or reverting a contract under such law. Try telling a judge in a contract dispute case that code is law and they have no authority to rule on the contract, maybe they'll thank you for the laugh. >but they don't depend on real world law enforcement to guarantee settlement. You're missing the parent's point: smart contracts can't teleport objects to you, or compel people to perform services for you. If you pay for a good or service and it's not delivered or performed, or you believe it wasn't adequately delivered or performed in accordance with the contract terms, you would go to court to enforce the contract as with any other. I will never understand why people believe these things have magic powers to alter the real world.
yieldcrv 4y ago
Just a note to everyone else passing by: financial services is one is the largest industries in the country and world it is a use case purely because there is insatiable demand of people with finances to service, which has extended to blockchains and smart contract platforms Ideology over the consensus mechanism of transaction settlement isnt a factor for those making revenue by providing financial services there are plenty of services without a token that work just fine, not everyone building things that are susceptible to arguments about ponzi schemes

joyfylbanana 4y ago

I still use only BTC and the reason why I use it is not because it is so great technically, I just don't like fiat.

infecto 4y ago
BTC is fiat right?
- Veen 4y ago
  No, fiat currencies are backed by states and central banks. BTC has some of the qualities of fiat currency—no commodity backing, etc—but it's not usually classified as one.
  - wonderwonder 4y ago
    If it's declared legal tender by government declaration or fiat, it's fiat currency. Btc is fiat currency in el Salvador
    - Veen 4y ago
      It's legal tender in El Salvador. Whether that makes it a fiat currency is a matter of definitions, so not really worth quibbling about.
      - wonderwonder 4y ago
        I'm not quibbling. It's fiat currency in El Salvador by any definition.
        ashwagary 4y ago
        Fiat money is created by decree without effort. Bitcoin is not "fiat" no matter who adopts it.
- hgsgm 4y ago
  It's decentralized fiat, so sort of hybrid between fiat and hard.
- kylebenzle1 4y ago
  BTC (one version of "Bitcoin") is a digital ponzi scheme for morons controlled by the for profit companies Blockstream and Bitfinx. BCH, the original version of Bitcoin is a Peer-to-Peer Digital Cash network, a replacement of government "fiat" currency.
- wonderwonder 4y ago
  It's fiat in a very limited number of countries. It's fungible.

j0hnyl 4y ago

The costs of building on smart contracts are really not that high. Dirt cheap on some chains. Anyway, I do love the crypto ecosystem, because I find it fun, but I don't really support the narrative that everyone should be onboarded onto it in some way or form. I'm much happier if it stays a toy for the nerds that like to play with it. There's also an element of counterculture to it as well. I also think there are some positive ripple-effects... I think there are people who have become more financially literate as a result of their interest in crypto and it's cool that adjacent technologies like IPFS have gotten more attention as a result.

chx 4y ago

Smart contracts have a serious problem: contracts are only as strong as the enforcement behind them are. If you peel back all the layers, at the end of the day, real world contracts have meaning because of the monopoly on violence by the state. In much simpler terms, if I contract with you to buy something and you do not deliver, what happens then?

SkyMarshal 4y ago
You don't have a choice not to deliver in a smart contract. You cryptographically commit to the contract the maximum amount you may have to pay out, and you can't reneg or claw it back in any way. When the contract settles, the code determines the payout automatically without further input from the counter-parties. You can't withhold anything. There are no capital calls, margin calls, or anything like that. The smart contract is basically an escrow service. There are two problems though: 1. For long-duration contracts, tying up that much capital is considered capital-inefficient by traditional financial system standards. It's tied up for a duration it could be making interest elsewhere, even if just the risk-free rate with T-bills or LIBOR. Conversely, it is very redundant and guarantees counterparty performance, there's no chance of a breach of contract. 2. Smart contracts that are settled by real-world data or events are subject to the oracle problem - you must trust both the data source, and its transmission onto the blockchain. If the oracle performing that function provides incorrect data, either accidentally or maliciously, it will cause the smart contract to settle incorrectly, and there's no recourse or claw back possible. So smart contracts are not without their challenges, but they don't depend on real world law enforcement to guarantee settlement.
- LiquidSky 4y ago
  >and you can't reneg or claw it back in any way >it will cause the smart contract to settle incorrectly, and there's no recourse or claw back possible. "Smart" contracts are subject to applicable contract law, and are susceptible to all normal causes for invalidating or reverting a contract under such law. Try telling a judge in a contract dispute case that code is law and they have no authority to rule on the contract, maybe they'll thank you for the laugh. >but they don't depend on real world law enforcement to guarantee settlement. You're missing the parent's point: smart contracts can't teleport objects to you, or compel people to perform services for you. If you pay for a good or service and it's not delivered or performed, or you believe it wasn't adequately delivered or performed in accordance with the contract terms, you would go to court to enforce the contract as with any other. I will never understand why people believe these things have magic powers to alter the real world.

yieldcrv 4y ago

Just a note to everyone else passing by: financial services is one is the largest industries in the country and world it is a use case purely because there is insatiable demand of people with finances to service, which has extended to blockchains and smart contract platforms Ideology over the consensus mechanism of transaction settlement isnt a factor for those making revenue by providing financial services there are plenty of services without a token that work just fine, not everyone building things that are susceptible to arguments about ponzi schemes