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This list of asked permissions xD. It's fortunate that one can go check the source code. The 48M APK is not exactly lightweight neither. I guess this is what i

by jraph 4y ago

This list of asked permissions xD. It's fortunate that one can go check the source code. The 48M APK is not exactly lightweight neither. I guess this is what it takes when implementing an OS in an Android app.

MikusR 4y ago
That's 5 times less than on Windows.
- jraph 4y ago
  zypper install --no-recommends emacs Loading repository data... Reading installed packages... Resolving package dependencies... The following 24 NEW packages are going to be installed: cpp13 emacs emacs-el emacs-eln emacs-info emacs-x11 etags gcc13 gnu-unifont-bitmap-fonts guile guile-modules-3_0 libXaw3d8 libgccjit0 libgsasl7 libguile-3_0-1 libhwasan0 libkyotocabinet16 libm17n0 libmailutils9 libntlm0 libotf1 m17n-db mailutils system-user-games 24 new packages to install. Overall download size: 112.3 MiB. Already cached: 0 B. After the operation, additional 374.4 MiB will be used. Continue? [y/n/v/...? shows all options] (y): Interesting (almost half of this is cpp13, gcc13 and libhwasan0 though).
crabbone 4y ago
I'm not the author, but I answered it above: any useful program on Android, if you want to use it in a way similar to how you'd use your PC will have to ignore Android's permissions model. That model is useful if your model user is restricted by system administrator to only performing a few tasks (i.e. users don't control their device). That whole idea flies out of the window once you want to do something like copy files or run an FTP server etc. My guess is that MS Windows or MacOS users will feel more at home with using their Android device because they are more used to the system telling them what they may or may not do. But, to Linux user this feels very user-ugly. Being in the latter category, I've been oscillating between two states of using my phone: either go all-in, and wipe the OS entirely replacing it with something sensible, or never trust it and don't put any personal data on the phone. Unfortunately, neither state is really feasible at this point. Living in an almost cash-less society, phone is almost a necessary payment tool (my bank tends to randomly lock my debit card every few months...) I also need to use my phone to authenticate to various government and work-related services. And that requires installing the toxic garbage OS on it. I wish services like cash payments and identification were provides as public interfaces instead of installable closed-source software... but, unfortunately, it seems like free software world had lost the battle for the phones. At least for now.
- jraph 4y ago
  > My guess is that MS Windows or MacOS users will feel more at home with using their Android device because they are more used to the system telling them what they may or may not do. But, to Linux user this feels very user-ugly. Don't lose patience though, it's coming on Linux too with Flatpaks :-) For instance the second screenshot of the latest post of "Adventures in Linux and KDE" [1] shows how it looks in Discover. [1] https://pointieststick.com/2023/02/17/this-week-in-kde-a-smooth-release-of-plasma-5-27/ https://pointieststick.com/2023/02/17/this-week-in-kde-a-smo...
  - crabbone 4y ago
    I work in a company that was acquired by a larger company about a year ago. The original company simply gave us laptops for work and asked to put full-disk encryption on them and to follow very general, but very sensible security requirements (eg. lock the screen if going away for long time, don't leave in the office unattended etc.) We were allowed to keep our original laptops so far. The IT department of the new overlords declared that eventually, they are going to retire our current generation of laptops and replace them with something that they, themselves, install and control. Users of such laptops will not have root access, for instance. Will have some mandatory garbage antivirus and other corporate spyware installed on them. The company is said to cycle their laptops every 4 years or so. And that's the time when I'm planning on handing in my two month notice. Yeah, it's possible to make Linux suck as much as Windows or MacOS (in this respect), but this will cause people to revolt. That's why I also won't use Flatpacks or similar containerized / read-only bind-mounted installs etc. This goes against the reason why I chose to use Linux. I feel upset and confused seeing how tools like these get more and more traction.
    - seanw444 4y ago
      I hate that companies do this. I'm very thankful to have found a job where my boss lets me basically self-manage my tasks, and my own hardware. I trust my security more than some IT guys.
    - jraph 4y ago
wazoox 4y ago
You know the acronym of old: "Eight Megabytes And Constantly Swapping" :D
- shagie 4y ago
  Eventually Mallocs All Computer Storage
  - cookiengineer 4y ago
    Escape Meta Alt Control Shift, all at once.

by jraph 4y ago

MikusR 4y ago

That's 5 times less than on Windows.

jraph 4y ago
zypper install --no-recommends emacs Loading repository data... Reading installed packages... Resolving package dependencies... The following 24 NEW packages are going to be installed: cpp13 emacs emacs-el emacs-eln emacs-info emacs-x11 etags gcc13 gnu-unifont-bitmap-fonts guile guile-modules-3_0 libXaw3d8 libgccjit0 libgsasl7 libguile-3_0-1 libhwasan0 libkyotocabinet16 libm17n0 libmailutils9 libntlm0 libotf1 m17n-db mailutils system-user-games 24 new packages to install. Overall download size: 112.3 MiB. Already cached: 0 B. After the operation, additional 374.4 MiB will be used. Continue? [y/n/v/...? shows all options] (y): Interesting (almost half of this is cpp13, gcc13 and libhwasan0 though).

crabbone 4y ago

I'm not the author, but I answered it above: any useful program on Android, if you want to use it in a way similar to how you'd use your PC will have to ignore Android's permissions model. That model is useful if your model user is restricted by system administrator to only performing a few tasks (i.e. users don't control their device). That whole idea flies out of the window once you want to do something like copy files or run an FTP server etc. My guess is that MS Windows or MacOS users will feel more at home with using their Android device because they are more used to the system telling them what they may or may not do. But, to Linux user this feels very user-ugly. Being in the latter category, I've been oscillating between two states of using my phone: either go all-in, and wipe the OS entirely replacing it with something sensible, or never trust it and don't put any personal data on the phone. Unfortunately, neither state is really feasible at this point. Living in an almost cash-less society, phone is almost a necessary payment tool (my bank tends to randomly lock my debit card every few months...) I also need to use my phone to authenticate to various government and work-related services. And that requires installing the toxic garbage OS on it. I wish services like cash payments and identification were provides as public interfaces instead of installable closed-source software... but, unfortunately, it seems like free software world had lost the battle for the phones. At least for now.

jraph 4y ago
> My guess is that MS Windows or MacOS users will feel more at home with using their Android device because they are more used to the system telling them what they may or may not do. But, to Linux user this feels very user-ugly. Don't lose patience though, it's coming on Linux too with Flatpaks :-) For instance the second screenshot of the latest post of "Adventures in Linux and KDE" [1] shows how it looks in Discover. [1] https://pointieststick.com/2023/02/17/this-week-in-kde-a-smooth-release-of-plasma-5-27/ https://pointieststick.com/2023/02/17/this-week-in-kde-a-smo...
- crabbone 4y ago
  I work in a company that was acquired by a larger company about a year ago. The original company simply gave us laptops for work and asked to put full-disk encryption on them and to follow very general, but very sensible security requirements (eg. lock the screen if going away for long time, don't leave in the office unattended etc.) We were allowed to keep our original laptops so far. The IT department of the new overlords declared that eventually, they are going to retire our current generation of laptops and replace them with something that they, themselves, install and control. Users of such laptops will not have root access, for instance. Will have some mandatory garbage antivirus and other corporate spyware installed on them. The company is said to cycle their laptops every 4 years or so. And that's the time when I'm planning on handing in my two month notice. Yeah, it's possible to make Linux suck as much as Windows or MacOS (in this respect), but this will cause people to revolt. That's why I also won't use Flatpacks or similar containerized / read-only bind-mounted installs etc. This goes against the reason why I chose to use Linux. I feel upset and confused seeing how tools like these get more and more traction.
  - seanw444 4y ago
    I hate that companies do this. I'm very thankful to have found a job where my boss lets me basically self-manage my tasks, and my own hardware. I trust my security more than some IT guys.
  - jraph 4y ago

wazoox 4y ago

You know the acronym of old: "Eight Megabytes And Constantly Swapping" :D

shagie 4y ago
Eventually Mallocs All Computer Storage
- cookiengineer 4y ago
  Escape Meta Alt Control Shift, all at once.