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> But what if developers see behind the veil? What if they begin to reflect and internalise Apple's abandonment of web apps after iOS 1.0 as an (eventual) exerc

> But what if developers see behind the veil? What if they begin to reflect and internalise Apple's abandonment of web apps after iOS 1.0 as an (eventual) exercise of monopolistic power that held the web back for more than a decade? Uh… I think I and every other developer has been saying this for many years. The number of developers who hadn’t “seen behind the veil” must be vanishingly small. Follow the Money was so obviously the reason. Don’t update Safari, reap that sweet sweet app money.

dmitriid 4y ago
> I think I and every other developer has been saying this for many years. Nope. Most developers haven't been saying this. Also, it's bullshit. I keep saying this: Android is 70% of world's market share. It has none of the "holding back the web" fully enjoying the Chrome monopoly with all its Chrome-only non-standards. And yet there are literally zero "amazing paradigm shifting world shattering on par with native" PWAs that we hear that Apple is holding back.
- irrational 4y ago
  > And yet there are literally zero "amazing paradigm shifting world shattering on par with native" PWAs Of course there aren’t. Nobody wants to build the same thing twice. Since PWAs are a no go on Safari, which, despite iOS being a minority compared to Android is still used by many of the wealthier coveted audiences, we would have to build it as a PWA for Android and native for iOS. We’ve consistently chosen not to do that. But, with these recent Safari changes, it might be enough for us to finally consider building PWAs.
  - dmitriid 4y ago
    > Of course there aren’t. Indeed > we would have to build it as a PWA for Android and native for iOS. We’ve consistently chosen not to do that. Translation: PWAs and their purported advantages are a myth > But, with these recent Safari changes, it might be enough for us to finally consider building PWAs. And they will invariably suck. Edit: It looks like the only "argument" for PWAs is "but on iOS the people have more money". (They also use much more powerful devices than most Androids out there). So the "argument" for PWAs is "we can't even pretend to care about 70% of the addressable market, and even with the purported advantages we can't even begin to think of building these amazing PWAs that would open the doors to people on non-expensive devices etc. because those people have no money and those people dont have powerful phones"

dmitriid 4y ago

> I think I and every other developer has been saying this for many years. Nope. Most developers haven't been saying this. Also, it's bullshit. I keep saying this: Android is 70% of world's market share. It has none of the "holding back the web" fully enjoying the Chrome monopoly with all its Chrome-only non-standards. And yet there are literally zero "amazing paradigm shifting world shattering on par with native" PWAs that we hear that Apple is holding back.

irrational 4y ago
> And yet there are literally zero "amazing paradigm shifting world shattering on par with native" PWAs Of course there aren’t. Nobody wants to build the same thing twice. Since PWAs are a no go on Safari, which, despite iOS being a minority compared to Android is still used by many of the wealthier coveted audiences, we would have to build it as a PWA for Android and native for iOS. We’ve consistently chosen not to do that. But, with these recent Safari changes, it might be enough for us to finally consider building PWAs.
- dmitriid 4y ago
  > Of course there aren’t. Indeed > we would have to build it as a PWA for Android and native for iOS. We’ve consistently chosen not to do that. Translation: PWAs and their purported advantages are a myth > But, with these recent Safari changes, it might be enough for us to finally consider building PWAs. And they will invariably suck. Edit: It looks like the only "argument" for PWAs is "but on iOS the people have more money". (They also use much more powerful devices than most Androids out there). So the "argument" for PWAs is "we can't even pretend to care about 70% of the addressable market, and even with the purported advantages we can't even begin to think of building these amazing PWAs that would open the doors to people on non-expensive devices etc. because those people have no money and those people dont have powerful phones"