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It's amazing what you can do when you don't need to apply for planning permission to put a 4g mast. They're everywhere - people rent out their rooftops to inter

It's amazing what you can do when you don't need to apply for planning permission to put a 4g mast. They're everywhere - people rent out their rooftops to internet companies. The blessing and curse of Vietnam: you can get away with nearly anything, but so can other people. It's a beautiful country though and changing incredible fast, mostly for the better. There's a huge and somewhat successful anti corruption drive going on in high level government over the past few years. If you've been away even for five years you'll see changes.

latchkey 4y ago
I spent 2016-2020 there and saw the rate of changes, even in that short time. I left literally right as covid started and wasn't able to go back. > The blessing and curse of Vietnam: you can get away with nearly anything, but so can other people. I quite enjoy the culture there... really opened my eyes quite a bit. > There's a huge and somewhat successful anti corruption drive going on in high level government over the past few years. I don't think that's something that is ever really going to change in my lifetime. There is corruption to the core, but I found that corruption isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, I'd much rather pay my "traffic ticket" on the street than deal with the bureaucracy of having to go to court and hope the officer doesn't show up. Choose your battles.
- esperent 4y ago
  > I'd much rather pay my "traffic ticket" on the street than deal with the bureaucracy I'm not talking about low level corruption like that. That will change later, hopefully, once the wages of police increase. I'm talking about high level corruption where a hospital is supposed to get built and instead the project gets stalled for years and then it turns out all the money mysteriously vanished. Or an entire minority village get kicked off their land to make way for a new resort, and a politician coincidentally gets a large cash gift. These are far more important to solve than police taking small bribes, and that's what they're working on now. I don't have enough insight or knowledge to comment on how successful they are likely to be but I wish them luck. One point about the low level corruption, though: like you say, it's very convenient to pay a small bribe on the street to avoid a traffic ticket. Unless you make $150 a month and that small bribe is actually your day's wages and you can't eat that day. So yeah, it's convenient, if you're wealthy, and terrible if you're poor. Like so many things in life.
  - latchkey 4y ago
    Yea, when I think of corruption, this comes to mind: https://e.vnexpress.net/photo/news/half-finished-hotel-projects-leave-central-vietnams-coast-wasted-4572836.html https://e.vnexpress.net/photo/news/half-finished-hotel-proje... It isn't just central, it is the entire coastline. > Unless you make $150 a month and that small bribe is actually your day's wages and you can't eat that day. Oh totally. So many times I've seen them loading bikes onto trucks because people couldn't afford to pay. There is a lot of really f'cked up stuff there for sure. I ended up just giving money away left and right, because I was lucky in that I could and it was the right thing to do. Nothing drives me nuts more than expats who complain about having to pay an extra 10k for something because the locals were 'ripping them off'...
    - esperent 4y ago
      > Nothing drives me nuts more than expats who complain about having to pay an extra 10k for something because the locals were 'ripping them off'... Not all expats are rich. Many Vietnamese are rich. So yeah, it is kind of shitty that if you're a foreigner you'll be overcharged for everything all the time. It's racism, to put it bluntly, and not a good part of Vietnamese culture. I think it's totally reasonable to be annoyed about racism.
- refurb 4y ago
  That kind of corruption (paying off cops) is absolutely toxic to economic development, just as much as the bigger scale corruption. You never know if your competitor will just bribe a government official to cancel your license. Or the bank is corrupt and your funds disappear. Its pervasive in Vietnam. During Covid government officials charged $10,000+ USD for repatriation flights. Funny thing is they did it to the wrong people and it got back to the government and several senior officials were charged. Covid tests were rife with corruption, and the Minister of Health got busted. Hell, Anti-corruption officials were caught taking bribes. Until Vietnam effectively deals with corruption it will stall as a middle income country. Singapore used to be like that and with independence the government clamped down hard and still do today. I know people who work for the Singapore government and things like “can you call your friend at immigration and check on my visa?” are a big no-no. They arent even supposed to talk to other departments except for legitimate reasons. A truck driver who gave $0.50-$1 to get to the front of the line at a factory to offload his truck was recently found guilty of bribery in Singapore. And so was the forklift operator ge gave the money to. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/man-taken-to-court-for-allegedly-trying-to-obtain-a-1-bribe-from-truck-driver https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/man-take... And as a result you can invest in Singapore and know your money wont be stolen by some crooked government worker. Its a safe haven in SE Asia unlike any other country.
  - latchkey 4y ago
    > That kind of corruption (paying off cops) is absolutely toxic to economic development You do realize that in order to get a cop job in Vietnam, you literally have to buy it? The corruption of 'paying cops off' actually happens much higher up. Singapore went to the opposite extreme and not entirely in the right way. When I worked for Grab, it was run by a religious nutter who made really awful decisions and the company was full of nepotism. There are still plenty of ways to lose money there, it just happens in different ways.
    - refurb 4y ago
      Im not sure either of your points are really relevant? Who cares if the cops has to pay someone else off? Corruption is corruption. And nepotism isnt corruption.

latchkey 4y ago

I spent 2016-2020 there and saw the rate of changes, even in that short time. I left literally right as covid started and wasn't able to go back. > The blessing and curse of Vietnam: you can get away with nearly anything, but so can other people. I quite enjoy the culture there... really opened my eyes quite a bit. > There's a huge and somewhat successful anti corruption drive going on in high level government over the past few years. I don't think that's something that is ever really going to change in my lifetime. There is corruption to the core, but I found that corruption isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, I'd much rather pay my "traffic ticket" on the street than deal with the bureaucracy of having to go to court and hope the officer doesn't show up. Choose your battles.

esperent 4y ago
> I'd much rather pay my "traffic ticket" on the street than deal with the bureaucracy I'm not talking about low level corruption like that. That will change later, hopefully, once the wages of police increase. I'm talking about high level corruption where a hospital is supposed to get built and instead the project gets stalled for years and then it turns out all the money mysteriously vanished. Or an entire minority village get kicked off their land to make way for a new resort, and a politician coincidentally gets a large cash gift. These are far more important to solve than police taking small bribes, and that's what they're working on now. I don't have enough insight or knowledge to comment on how successful they are likely to be but I wish them luck. One point about the low level corruption, though: like you say, it's very convenient to pay a small bribe on the street to avoid a traffic ticket. Unless you make $150 a month and that small bribe is actually your day's wages and you can't eat that day. So yeah, it's convenient, if you're wealthy, and terrible if you're poor. Like so many things in life.
- latchkey 4y ago
  Yea, when I think of corruption, this comes to mind: https://e.vnexpress.net/photo/news/half-finished-hotel-projects-leave-central-vietnams-coast-wasted-4572836.html https://e.vnexpress.net/photo/news/half-finished-hotel-proje... It isn't just central, it is the entire coastline. > Unless you make $150 a month and that small bribe is actually your day's wages and you can't eat that day. Oh totally. So many times I've seen them loading bikes onto trucks because people couldn't afford to pay. There is a lot of really f'cked up stuff there for sure. I ended up just giving money away left and right, because I was lucky in that I could and it was the right thing to do. Nothing drives me nuts more than expats who complain about having to pay an extra 10k for something because the locals were 'ripping them off'...
  - esperent 4y ago
    > Nothing drives me nuts more than expats who complain about having to pay an extra 10k for something because the locals were 'ripping them off'... Not all expats are rich. Many Vietnamese are rich. So yeah, it is kind of shitty that if you're a foreigner you'll be overcharged for everything all the time. It's racism, to put it bluntly, and not a good part of Vietnamese culture. I think it's totally reasonable to be annoyed about racism.
refurb 4y ago
That kind of corruption (paying off cops) is absolutely toxic to economic development, just as much as the bigger scale corruption. You never know if your competitor will just bribe a government official to cancel your license. Or the bank is corrupt and your funds disappear. Its pervasive in Vietnam. During Covid government officials charged $10,000+ USD for repatriation flights. Funny thing is they did it to the wrong people and it got back to the government and several senior officials were charged. Covid tests were rife with corruption, and the Minister of Health got busted. Hell, Anti-corruption officials were caught taking bribes. Until Vietnam effectively deals with corruption it will stall as a middle income country. Singapore used to be like that and with independence the government clamped down hard and still do today. I know people who work for the Singapore government and things like “can you call your friend at immigration and check on my visa?” are a big no-no. They arent even supposed to talk to other departments except for legitimate reasons. A truck driver who gave $0.50-$1 to get to the front of the line at a factory to offload his truck was recently found guilty of bribery in Singapore. And so was the forklift operator ge gave the money to. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/man-taken-to-court-for-allegedly-trying-to-obtain-a-1-bribe-from-truck-driver https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/man-take... And as a result you can invest in Singapore and know your money wont be stolen by some crooked government worker. Its a safe haven in SE Asia unlike any other country.
- latchkey 4y ago
  > That kind of corruption (paying off cops) is absolutely toxic to economic development You do realize that in order to get a cop job in Vietnam, you literally have to buy it? The corruption of 'paying cops off' actually happens much higher up. Singapore went to the opposite extreme and not entirely in the right way. When I worked for Grab, it was run by a religious nutter who made really awful decisions and the company was full of nepotism. There are still plenty of ways to lose money there, it just happens in different ways.
  - refurb 4y ago
    Im not sure either of your points are really relevant? Who cares if the cops has to pay someone else off? Corruption is corruption. And nepotism isnt corruption.