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> Yes people would still lose money, but at least the fraudsters wouldn't learn that crime pays, and survive to defraud another day. So to be clear, your solut

> Yes people would still lose money, but at least the fraudsters wouldn't learn that crime pays, and survive to defraud another day. So to be clear, your solution is that the victims will still be the victims. all scammers will get away with their scams, and that of those that steal millions and choose not to hop to another country that some percentage of the will be punished? And as a result that's reasonable? There is a reason the police respond to bank robberies in progress and don't just wait to try to collect stolen cash via an investigation after the fact. The number of attempted bank robberies would be through the roof. And the reason for ignoring all of this crime is what? Because a percentage of the people presumed to be running scams might actually be doing something legit? Didn't something like half of all coins fail? With some very large percentage of the being flat our rug pulls? It's incredible the knots crypto people will twist to try to justify it. Create a whole new set of problems, then poorly solve a portion of them, worse than they are solved in other forms and then try to claim it's a breakthrough. Hopefully most of those scammers move to AI where it's harder to just directly rip people off.

ETH_start 4y ago
>>So to be clear, your solution is that the victims will still be the victims. all scammers will get away with their scams, and that of those that steal millions and choose not to hop to another country that some percentage of the will be punished? And as a result that's reasonable? Not sure how you can read my statement, which included "but at least fraudsters wouldn't learn that crime pays, and survive to defraud another day", and interpret it that way. I'd like aggressive prosecution of actual fraud (as opposed to prosecuting people for failing to follow the processes regimented by regulations). >>Didn't something like half of all coins fail? That's the nature of venture capital investment. Failure is okay. Critically, much more more was earned by token sale investors than they invested in the aggregate. And the technology allowed much smaller investors to benefit from these returns, by massively expanding financial inclusivity: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11408-020-00366-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11408-020-00366-0 "The average ICO has almost 4700 contributors. The median contributor invests a relatively small amount. The ICO market appears to have successfully given access to the financing of innovation to a new class of investors, which is a long-standing public policy issue"
- BoiledCabbage 4y ago
  You're trying to chase down the horses after they've left the barn. There is no way the govt is going to be able to catch them all or even most. They don't remotely have the resources. The reward for fraud is some enormous sum. It is 1000x better to drastically minimize the occurrences of, or prevent fraud, than try to catch everyone afterwards.
  - ETH_start 4y ago
    I think the government can catch nearly all token sale fraudsters. They leave mountains of evidence. It just requires putting in the resources to conduct the investigations and following through with laying charges and prosecuting the cases. The government spends trillions of dollars each year. Any serious effort to track down and punish fraudsters can be fully funded. And the costs of enforcement will rapidly decline as the government establishes credibility that it will consistently punish fraud. IMHO, our society should show zero tolerance for predatory behavior.
    - p1necone 4y ago
      You have a point there. Most crypto scams are blatantly obvious Ponzi schemes or pump and dumps being openly discussed in some discord channel. This stuff should be pretty trivial for investigators, but maybe the sheer volume is just too much.
hattmall 4y ago
>There is a reason the police respond to bank robberies in progress and don't just wait to try to collect stolen cash via an investigation after the fact. The number of attempted bank robberies would be through the roof. They really don't though. Can you find sources in recent history of police responding to in progress bank robberies? After a few high profile incidents that turned deadly the standard for dealing with bank robberies is to do everything possible to avoid a hostage situation or violent confrontation. Banks don't generally have tremendous amounts of cash on hand.

ETH_start 4y ago

>>So to be clear, your solution is that the victims will still be the victims. all scammers will get away with their scams, and that of those that steal millions and choose not to hop to another country that some percentage of the will be punished? And as a result that's reasonable? Not sure how you can read my statement, which included "but at least fraudsters wouldn't learn that crime pays, and survive to defraud another day", and interpret it that way. I'd like aggressive prosecution of actual fraud (as opposed to prosecuting people for failing to follow the processes regimented by regulations). >>Didn't something like half of all coins fail? That's the nature of venture capital investment. Failure is okay. Critically, much more more was earned by token sale investors than they invested in the aggregate. And the technology allowed much smaller investors to benefit from these returns, by massively expanding financial inclusivity: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11408-020-00366-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11408-020-00366-0 "The average ICO has almost 4700 contributors. The median contributor invests a relatively small amount. The ICO market appears to have successfully given access to the financing of innovation to a new class of investors, which is a long-standing public policy issue"

BoiledCabbage 4y ago
You're trying to chase down the horses after they've left the barn. There is no way the govt is going to be able to catch them all or even most. They don't remotely have the resources. The reward for fraud is some enormous sum. It is 1000x better to drastically minimize the occurrences of, or prevent fraud, than try to catch everyone afterwards.
- ETH_start 4y ago
  I think the government can catch nearly all token sale fraudsters. They leave mountains of evidence. It just requires putting in the resources to conduct the investigations and following through with laying charges and prosecuting the cases. The government spends trillions of dollars each year. Any serious effort to track down and punish fraudsters can be fully funded. And the costs of enforcement will rapidly decline as the government establishes credibility that it will consistently punish fraud. IMHO, our society should show zero tolerance for predatory behavior.
  - p1necone 4y ago
    You have a point there. Most crypto scams are blatantly obvious Ponzi schemes or pump and dumps being openly discussed in some discord channel. This stuff should be pretty trivial for investigators, but maybe the sheer volume is just too much.

hattmall 4y ago

>There is a reason the police respond to bank robberies in progress and don't just wait to try to collect stolen cash via an investigation after the fact. The number of attempted bank robberies would be through the roof. They really don't though. Can you find sources in recent history of police responding to in progress bank robberies? After a few high profile incidents that turned deadly the standard for dealing with bank robberies is to do everything possible to avoid a hostage situation or violent confrontation. Banks don't generally have tremendous amounts of cash on hand.