3 ms·
If we want to move the needle in a meaningful way (CO2 wise), heat pumps and solar panels need to get better, cheaper, easier to install, and more available. W
by manmal 4y ago
If we want to move the needle in a meaningful way (CO2 wise), heat pumps and solar panels need to get better, cheaper, easier to install, and more available.
Where I live, driving a heat pump is more expensive than burning gas, from a purely economical POV. Our cost ratio per kW/h for electricity:gas is 3.5:1 right now, but COP for consumer heat pumps in real-world usage is just 2.6 (Yeah they all claim a COP of at least 3, but those are as realistic as ICE fuel economy ratings.) Those ratios need to at least match in order for a heat pump to make any kind of financial sense.
Those heat pumps for a mid sized house cost €15k right now. On back order for 12+ months.
- teruakohatu 4y agoA real world mean COP of 3.5 is not unusual, see this paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0378778821006496 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S037877882... Gas isn't 100% efficient either in heating the home. Boilers are ~92%.
- manmal 4y agoA German consumer report mentioned 2.6 (can’t find it right now), maybe that’s owed to Germany‘s climate.
- adam_arthur 4y agoUsing a heatpump likely actually worsens CO2 impact, as most utilities providing the electricity don’t run on green energy. E.g. you can either burn natural gas directly, or use electricity the Utility generated by burning natural gas. Or even Coal in many cases. But that’s speaking more to the impact today. In the long run electrification across the board is required to reduce emissions.
- manmal 4y agoReally depends on where you live. In Austria, it’s cleaner to use a heatpump.
- adam_arthur 4y agoLooks like Austria's mix is quite clean, mostly Hydro Power: https://www.statista.com/statistics/1234896/austria-distribution-of-electricity-production-by-source/#:~:text=Hydropower%20is%20the%20main%20source,in%20terms%20of%20renewable%20output https://www.statista.com/statistics/1234896/austria-distribu.... The US is still 60% Natural Gas + Coal https://www.statista.com/statistics/528603/distribution-electricity-net-generation-in-the-us-by-fuel-type/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/528603/distribution-elec...
- ttyprintk 4y agoDisregarding differences in NG price between utilities and households, I see different numbers than that. 60% efficient NG turbines, onto a 85% grid, and a 2.6 COP at home means no NG furnace can compete until the weather hits winter lows. I don’t see how it can make it worse.
- ttyprintk 4y agoDoes it make sense to include a cooling term in that comparison?