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In reply to all the Iran hostility... Iran is not such a bad country. I can know because I've been traveling it for 5 weeks. It's a weird place, with a govt

by cies 15y ago

In reply to all the Iran hostility... Iran is not such a bad country. I can know because I've been traveling it for 5 weeks. It's a weird place, with a govt that is not much supported by the educated-youth. But not all that bad as the media try to make us believe. US has not closed Guatanamo, where they do their own share of trial-less, unfair-trail and/or unreasonable-trial sentence execution (including death penalty). Should we all now boycott the US? "Porn" is quite clearly just the flag under which this guy is punished for leaving (deserting) his country. Prisoners in Guatanamo similarly have an "official reason" for being there. Believe me, here in the Netherlands I know some folks with strong sentiments agains the US, and I tell them the same: "The US is not such a bad country". So maybe it is just me :)

jmduke 15y ago
Being a "bad country" is not relative. Denial of due process is an abomination of human rights, regardless of the number of countries committing it.
eternalban 15y ago
"Islamic Republic" of Iran is =/= Iran. As an American of Iranian descent I implore you to make note of this critically important difference. Thank you.
paulhauggis 15y ago
"Iran is not such a bad country. I can know because I've been traveling it for 5 weeks. It's a weird place, with a govt that is not much supported by the educated-youth. But not all that bad as the media try to make us believe." I'm sorry, but if the government of a country is going execute someone for "violating the sanctity of Islam", they are a bad country. By accepting this behavior, you are just allowing it to continue. I don't accept it and I will always be against a country that treats its citizens this way. More people need to stand up to this bullshit. "Believe me, here in the Netherlands I know some folks with strong sentiments agains the US, and I tell them the same: "The US is not such a bad country". So maybe it is just me :)" The US has some problems, but it's still better than 99% of the world in terms of freedom. Unlike the US, Most of the world has state-controlled media and an Internet Firewall. Hopefully, it never happens here in the US.
- smokinn 15y ago
  So "most of the world" is China and some muslim countries? I'm pretty sure Canada, India, most of Africa and pretty much all of Europe have neither state-controlled media nor an internet firewall. Of course, I do agree that people need to know about and boycott such regimes as much as they can.
- mattmanser 15y ago
  99%'s incredibly naive, more like 50%. Just to remind you America has: By far the highest incarceration rate of a 'free' country An abnormally high murder rate A recent history of torture and incarceration of foreigners without trial Not particularly free in my book, especially the propensity to lock up relatively high proportion of its own citizens.
  - nate_meurer 15y ago
    Quite right. Plus, I'd like to add, highly corrupt legislative bodies. Perhaps not nearly as corrupt as in many other places, but the stench of money and cronyism is pervasive in American politics.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- pooriaazimi 15y ago
  > By accepting this behavior, you are just allowing it to continue. I don't accept it and I will always be against a country that treats its citizens this way. More people need to stand up to this bullshit. I'm sorry, but you must be living in a dream world, where governments just sit back and allow the opposition to overthrow them... You know, it's a little harder to do that when the government in question is extremely rich (oil, gas, ...) and most things are state-owned, than in a country where the government lives off taxes and has to 'borrow' money from private banks!
- nate_meurer 15y ago
  Holy hyperbole! 99%? Most of the world has state-controlled media? If the Iranian government violates the human rights of its citizens, that makes Iran a "bad country"? Are you being serious?
JS_startup 15y ago
A man is being executed because software he wrote was used in a pornographic website. It's pretty reprehensible that you feel the need to try and derail the topic and apologize for Iran by drawing similarities to the US as if that makes it OK. But hey, thanks for downplaying this dude's impending death! edit: I'm also not sure that the detention of captured combatants and the execution of a native citizen are quite the same thing
- batista 15y ago
  """I'm also not sure that the detention of captured combatants and the execution of a native citizen are quite the same thing""" Actually, the "detention of captured combatants" is worse. Those "combatants" are not soldiers, and a lot of them are innocent (see: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8472804/WikiLeaks-children-among-the-innocent-captured-and-sent-to-Guantanamo.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8472804/... - http://www.amazon.com/Five-Years-My-Life-Guantanamo/dp/0230603742 http://www.amazon.com/Five-Years-My-Life-Guantanamo/dp/02306... and lots of other examples). Even the guilty ones are held illegally, with no due process, no formal allegations, and against the US and international law. Furthermore, most of those are not americans, but captured citizens and residents of another country. The equivalent would be Iranian army guys coming to your house in New York, Montana or whatever, abducting you arbitrarily and holding you indefinitely in some hell hole. For some reason, the US considers it legit to do the same to citizens of other countries. Now, in this particular case, Iran is in the wrong. But it's not like his status as a programmer or the porn accusation BS are the reason they are executing him. They probably see him as a dissident, or they have some suspicions in him being a spy or something, that they don't reveal. Which reminds me: which country, based on lies they told regarding the existence of weapons of mass destruction, invaded another country, causing thousands of deaths and massive instability in the area, including unleashing hard core fundamentalist fights? Suddenly, one guy being executed in Iran seems not that important, doesn't it? Or are tens and hundreds of thousand of deaths OK when US does them, and bad when some foreign government does them? Moreover, it's disgusting how this kind of stories are played and orchestrated by the media not out of concern about that one guy (if that was the case, the concern would be shared to other guys in the same situation, including in Saudi Arabia and the US itself), but to turn the people to justify some incoming invasion against Iran. Does the case of Mumia Abu-Jamal and hundreds like him justify an attack on the US?
nate_meurer 15y ago
This is wrong in so many ways, I hardly know where to start. The evil done by the U.S. government does not excuse evil in other places. Regarding Guanatanamo: the way in which the U.S. deals with un-uniformed combatants has been ferociously litigated from within the U.S. by civil rights organizations. Discussion of the matter occurs in public, without fear of reprisal. The detention policies have been condemned in public by high-ranking members of the U.S. government and military. Although we have detained men who are clearly and completely innocent, no detainee has been sentenced to death. Some who have been released have subsequently returned to the battlefield to fight against us once again. Even if what you say about guantanamo were entirely true, in no way would it excuse the actions of the theocratic regime in Iran which is happy to overtly and unaccountably murder its own citizens for the purpose of propaganda. > "Should we all now boycott the US?" There are many reasons to boycott the US. I'm sure you've noticed the froth over SOPA/PIPA recently, for example. Again, the evil present in our government doesn't excuse evil in other places. > "The US is not such a bad country" Tell your friends whatever you want; if your reasoning involves excusing the actions of the Iranian government, your advice is worth exactly nothing.
- alan_cx 15y ago
  "he evil done by the U.S. government doesn't excuse evil in other places." Hm, yet it seems evil done in other places does excuse US evil.
  - nate_meurer 15y ago
    Are you talking about the current push to sanction/bomb Iran for its alleged nuke program? Sadly, I think what you say is true of many Americans. Happily though, there are also a great number of American who disagree, loudly and vehemently.
tikhonj 15y ago
To me, your post didn't say "Iran isn't so bad" as much as "The US isn't so good". Which is not an unreasonable point, if not the one you were trying to make.

by cies 15y ago

jmduke 15y ago

Being a "bad country" is not relative. Denial of due process is an abomination of human rights, regardless of the number of countries committing it.

eternalban 15y ago

"Islamic Republic" of Iran is =/= Iran. As an American of Iranian descent I implore you to make note of this critically important difference. Thank you.

paulhauggis 15y ago

"Iran is not such a bad country. I can know because I've been traveling it for 5 weeks. It's a weird place, with a govt that is not much supported by the educated-youth. But not all that bad as the media try to make us believe." I'm sorry, but if the government of a country is going execute someone for "violating the sanctity of Islam", they are a bad country. By accepting this behavior, you are just allowing it to continue. I don't accept it and I will always be against a country that treats its citizens this way. More people need to stand up to this bullshit. "Believe me, here in the Netherlands I know some folks with strong sentiments agains the US, and I tell them the same: "The US is not such a bad country". So maybe it is just me :)" The US has some problems, but it's still better than 99% of the world in terms of freedom. Unlike the US, Most of the world has state-controlled media and an Internet Firewall. Hopefully, it never happens here in the US.

smokinn 15y ago
So "most of the world" is China and some muslim countries? I'm pretty sure Canada, India, most of Africa and pretty much all of Europe have neither state-controlled media nor an internet firewall. Of course, I do agree that people need to know about and boycott such regimes as much as they can.
mattmanser 15y ago
99%'s incredibly naive, more like 50%. Just to remind you America has: By far the highest incarceration rate of a 'free' country An abnormally high murder rate A recent history of torture and incarceration of foreigners without trial Not particularly free in my book, especially the propensity to lock up relatively high proportion of its own citizens.
- nate_meurer 15y ago
  Quite right. Plus, I'd like to add, highly corrupt legislative bodies. Perhaps not nearly as corrupt as in many other places, but the stench of money and cronyism is pervasive in American politics.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
pooriaazimi 15y ago
> By accepting this behavior, you are just allowing it to continue. I don't accept it and I will always be against a country that treats its citizens this way. More people need to stand up to this bullshit. I'm sorry, but you must be living in a dream world, where governments just sit back and allow the opposition to overthrow them... You know, it's a little harder to do that when the government in question is extremely rich (oil, gas, ...) and most things are state-owned, than in a country where the government lives off taxes and has to 'borrow' money from private banks!
nate_meurer 15y ago
Holy hyperbole! 99%? Most of the world has state-controlled media? If the Iranian government violates the human rights of its citizens, that makes Iran a "bad country"? Are you being serious?

JS_startup 15y ago

A man is being executed because software he wrote was used in a pornographic website. It's pretty reprehensible that you feel the need to try and derail the topic and apologize for Iran by drawing similarities to the US as if that makes it OK. But hey, thanks for downplaying this dude's impending death! edit: I'm also not sure that the detention of captured combatants and the execution of a native citizen are quite the same thing

batista 15y ago
"""I'm also not sure that the detention of captured combatants and the execution of a native citizen are quite the same thing""" Actually, the "detention of captured combatants" is worse. Those "combatants" are not soldiers, and a lot of them are innocent (see: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8472804/WikiLeaks-children-among-the-innocent-captured-and-sent-to-Guantanamo.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8472804/... - http://www.amazon.com/Five-Years-My-Life-Guantanamo/dp/0230603742 http://www.amazon.com/Five-Years-My-Life-Guantanamo/dp/02306... and lots of other examples). Even the guilty ones are held illegally, with no due process, no formal allegations, and against the US and international law. Furthermore, most of those are not americans, but captured citizens and residents of another country. The equivalent would be Iranian army guys coming to your house in New York, Montana or whatever, abducting you arbitrarily and holding you indefinitely in some hell hole. For some reason, the US considers it legit to do the same to citizens of other countries. Now, in this particular case, Iran is in the wrong. But it's not like his status as a programmer or the porn accusation BS are the reason they are executing him. They probably see him as a dissident, or they have some suspicions in him being a spy or something, that they don't reveal. Which reminds me: which country, based on lies they told regarding the existence of weapons of mass destruction, invaded another country, causing thousands of deaths and massive instability in the area, including unleashing hard core fundamentalist fights? Suddenly, one guy being executed in Iran seems not that important, doesn't it? Or are tens and hundreds of thousand of deaths OK when US does them, and bad when some foreign government does them? Moreover, it's disgusting how this kind of stories are played and orchestrated by the media not out of concern about that one guy (if that was the case, the concern would be shared to other guys in the same situation, including in Saudi Arabia and the US itself), but to turn the people to justify some incoming invasion against Iran. Does the case of Mumia Abu-Jamal and hundreds like him justify an attack on the US?

nate_meurer 15y ago

This is wrong in so many ways, I hardly know where to start. The evil done by the U.S. government does not excuse evil in other places. Regarding Guanatanamo: the way in which the U.S. deals with un-uniformed combatants has been ferociously litigated from within the U.S. by civil rights organizations. Discussion of the matter occurs in public, without fear of reprisal. The detention policies have been condemned in public by high-ranking members of the U.S. government and military. Although we have detained men who are clearly and completely innocent, no detainee has been sentenced to death. Some who have been released have subsequently returned to the battlefield to fight against us once again. Even if what you say about guantanamo were entirely true, in no way would it excuse the actions of the theocratic regime in Iran which is happy to overtly and unaccountably murder its own citizens for the purpose of propaganda. > "Should we all now boycott the US?" There are many reasons to boycott the US. I'm sure you've noticed the froth over SOPA/PIPA recently, for example. Again, the evil present in our government doesn't excuse evil in other places. > "The US is not such a bad country" Tell your friends whatever you want; if your reasoning involves excusing the actions of the Iranian government, your advice is worth exactly nothing.

alan_cx 15y ago
"he evil done by the U.S. government doesn't excuse evil in other places." Hm, yet it seems evil done in other places does excuse US evil.
- nate_meurer 15y ago
  Are you talking about the current push to sanction/bomb Iran for its alleged nuke program? Sadly, I think what you say is true of many Americans. Happily though, there are also a great number of American who disagree, loudly and vehemently.

tikhonj 15y ago

To me, your post didn't say "Iran isn't so bad" as much as "The US isn't so good". Which is not an unreasonable point, if not the one you were trying to make.