8 ms·

Would HN be exempt or you'd punish it too? There are job ads for the YC companies.

by cft 4y ago

cratermoon 4y ago
Do the YC companies pay for placement alongside relevant content and get preferential visibility over non-paying content? If so, then no, HN doesn't get a pass.
- cft 4y ago
  Yes they do get preferential placement, independent of the upvote scores (there are no upvote buttons) YC runs Hacker News and invests its resources into promotion of YC companies' job ads, hoping to increase return on its investment. Wikipedia pays high salaries to its executives, the money that it derives from its user's donations. Strip them all of Section 230 protection?
  - rlpb 4y ago
    It may be difficult to define a line, but I think a line needs to be drawn. When "platforms" editorialize content for the purposes of manipulating user behaviour, rather than merely to act in users' interests in helping them find what they want, then I'm in favour of them losing protection. HN does the latter, so I think it'd be appropriate for HN to keep its protection.
    - cft 4y ago
      If you read the amicus briefs you will see that once you draw the line, you open the door for lawsuits to establish whether the line has been crossed in each case, with the costly discovery phase, instead of a blanket "cannot sue" now. Goodbye bootstrapped startups with user generated content or your favorite internet forum/mailing list after that.
      - cratermoon 4y ago
        That's a problem with the American legal system, independent of this or any particular social hazard.
        flakeoil 4y ago
        Yes, it's funny how a huge amount of listed companies in the US have lawsuits against them because their stocks have gone down. Lawyers looking for clients who lost some money and then they sue. The lawyer earns money no matter what, and if they win then they get a big payout.
  - NoZebra120vClip 4y ago
    User Content Transmitted Through the Site: With respect to the content or other materials you upload through the Site or share with other users or recipients (collectively, “User Content”), you represent and warrant that you own all right, title and interest in and to such User Content, including, without limitation, all copyrights and rights of publicity contained therein. By uploading any User Content you hereby grant and will grant Y Combinator and its affiliated companies a nonexclusive, worldwide, royalty free, fully paid up, transferable, sublicensable, perpetual, irrevocable license to copy, display, upload, perform, distribute, store, modify and otherwise use your User Content for any Y Combinator-related purpose in any form, medium or technology now known or later developed. However, please review the Applications Privacy Policy located at https://www.ycombinator.com/apply/privacy https://www.ycombinator.com/apply/privacy, for more information on how we treat information included in applications submitted to us. https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/ https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/
  - cratermoon 4y ago
    My short comment did not capture the essence of my concerns, so let me suggest some background reading. 1 The Attention Economy: Where the Customer Becomes the Product – https://journal.businesstoday.org/bt-online/2021/the-attention-economy-asher-joy https://journal.businesstoday.org/bt-online/2021/the-attenti... 2 Forget Data. Free Labor Is Facebook’s Lifeblood – https://mashable.com/article/free-labor-facebook-profits https://mashable.com/article/free-labor-facebook-profits 3 Williams, James. 2018. Stand Out of Our Light: Freedom and Resistance in the Attention Economy. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press. 4 The Scientists Who Make Apps Addictive – https://web.archive.org/web/20210416052902/https://www.economist.com/1843/2016/10/20/the-scientists-who-make-apps-addictive https://web.archive.org/web/20210416052902/https://www.econo... 5 A Call To Minimize Distraction – http://www.minimizedistraction.com/ http://www.minimizedistraction.com/ 6 Slow Tech – https://vimeo.com/240721308 https://vimeo.com/240721308, transcript at https://www.interaxiongroup.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/were_creating_a_culture_of_distraction.pdf https://www.interaxiongroup.org/sites/default/files/media/pd... 7 Ethics of the Attention Economy: The Problem of Social Media Addiction – https://doi.org/10.1017/beq.2020.32 https://doi.org/10.1017/beq.2020.32 8 Odell, J. (2019). How to do nothing: Resisting the attention economy. Melville House.

Would HN be exempt or you'd punish it too? There are job ads for the YC companies.

by cft 4y ago

Would HN be exempt or you'd punish it too? There are job ads for the YC companies.

Do the YC companies pay for placement alongside relevant content and get preferential visibility over non-paying content? If so, then no, HN doesn't get a pass.

cft 4y ago
Yes they do get preferential placement, independent of the upvote scores (there are no upvote buttons) YC runs Hacker News and invests its resources into promotion of YC companies' job ads, hoping to increase return on its investment. Wikipedia pays high salaries to its executives, the money that it derives from its user's donations. Strip them all of Section 230 protection?
- rlpb 4y ago
  It may be difficult to define a line, but I think a line needs to be drawn. When "platforms" editorialize content for the purposes of manipulating user behaviour, rather than merely to act in users' interests in helping them find what they want, then I'm in favour of them losing protection. HN does the latter, so I think it'd be appropriate for HN to keep its protection.
  - cft 4y ago
    If you read the amicus briefs you will see that once you draw the line, you open the door for lawsuits to establish whether the line has been crossed in each case, with the costly discovery phase, instead of a blanket "cannot sue" now. Goodbye bootstrapped startups with user generated content or your favorite internet forum/mailing list after that.
    - cratermoon 4y ago
      That's a problem with the American legal system, independent of this or any particular social hazard.
      - flakeoil 4y ago
        Yes, it's funny how a huge amount of listed companies in the US have lawsuits against them because their stocks have gone down. Lawyers looking for clients who lost some money and then they sue. The lawyer earns money no matter what, and if they win then they get a big payout.
- NoZebra120vClip 4y ago
  User Content Transmitted Through the Site: With respect to the content or other materials you upload through the Site or share with other users or recipients (collectively, “User Content”), you represent and warrant that you own all right, title and interest in and to such User Content, including, without limitation, all copyrights and rights of publicity contained therein. By uploading any User Content you hereby grant and will grant Y Combinator and its affiliated companies a nonexclusive, worldwide, royalty free, fully paid up, transferable, sublicensable, perpetual, irrevocable license to copy, display, upload, perform, distribute, store, modify and otherwise use your User Content for any Y Combinator-related purpose in any form, medium or technology now known or later developed. However, please review the Applications Privacy Policy located at https://www.ycombinator.com/apply/privacy https://www.ycombinator.com/apply/privacy, for more information on how we treat information included in applications submitted to us. https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/ https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/
- cratermoon 4y ago
  My short comment did not capture the essence of my concerns, so let me suggest some background reading. 1 The Attention Economy: Where the Customer Becomes the Product – https://journal.businesstoday.org/bt-online/2021/the-attention-economy-asher-joy https://journal.businesstoday.org/bt-online/2021/the-attenti... 2 Forget Data. Free Labor Is Facebook’s Lifeblood – https://mashable.com/article/free-labor-facebook-profits https://mashable.com/article/free-labor-facebook-profits 3 Williams, James. 2018. Stand Out of Our Light: Freedom and Resistance in the Attention Economy. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press. 4 The Scientists Who Make Apps Addictive – https://web.archive.org/web/20210416052902/https://www.economist.com/1843/2016/10/20/the-scientists-who-make-apps-addictive https://web.archive.org/web/20210416052902/https://www.econo... 5 A Call To Minimize Distraction – http://www.minimizedistraction.com/ http://www.minimizedistraction.com/ 6 Slow Tech – https://vimeo.com/240721308 https://vimeo.com/240721308, transcript at https://www.interaxiongroup.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/were_creating_a_culture_of_distraction.pdf https://www.interaxiongroup.org/sites/default/files/media/pd... 7 Ethics of the Attention Economy: The Problem of Social Media Addiction – https://doi.org/10.1017/beq.2020.32 https://doi.org/10.1017/beq.2020.32 8 Odell, J. (2019). How to do nothing: Resisting the attention economy. Melville House.