3 ms·

Sure, humans create the information for the model, but you seem to be implying that the responses themselves are actually written by people, which is not correc

Sure, humans create the information for the model, but you seem to be implying that the responses themselves are actually written by people, which is not correct. And as mentioned in other comments, OpenAI is constantly trying to close the loopholes exploited by DAN.

steponlego 4y ago
I haven't access to the interal workings of OpenAI, despite the name it's all proprietary, so there's really no way I can test this and neither can you. It could all be written by humans for all anybody knows. Or just some. Neither you nor I have any way to tell other than by applying Turing tests or what have you.
- pixl97 4y ago
  I mean, some skepticism is good, but at some point hanlon's razor really starts to go against you.... OpenAI has had a large investment by Microsoft, and in turn is using a lot of Microsofts cloud computing resources. In fact Microsoft thought what they were doing was interesting enough they built their own 'BingChat' layer over the technology. Now, Microsoft could have gone in half blind completely unware that OpenAI was farming this off to an absolutely massive number of humans answering the questions, but doesn't that seem a little, um questionable as it's very likely that Microsoft is hosting it's own instances of the software? At this point I think your disagreement with what is occurring is drifting from 'this company is lying about what is going on' to the place of 'software is starting to make me feel deeply uncomfortable with my place in this universe'.
  - steponlego 4y ago
    All I'm saying is simply a logical fact - that you and I can't prove this thing is doing what it says in a way we can independently verify. It reminds me of Kasparov and the Machine, the movie which documented the famous chess match between IBM and Kasparov. They initially promised the thing wouldn't be hooked to a network, then they hooked it to the network after it started to lose and it finally won. Kasparov, before learning they had hooked it up, complained that the moves seemed to him to be as if a committee of his rivals had teamed up against him, and as the documentary showed, indeed IBM had recruited just the team of rivals he fingered to guide IBM's team. AI grifting is an ancient Big Tech trick, going back to before most of HN was even born. There are other examples of this but one should be skeptical about AI unless it's laid bare in the form of portable, Free source code one can inspect and run even in isolation from the Internet for one's self. The fact that people dumped money into it is not proof or even evidence that it works properly or at all.
    - pixl97 4y ago
      So all transformer models recently are just grift and making stuff up? Like the model of stable diffusion pumping out art on my GPU is actually making calls where Indian kids are frantically scrabbling in paint to return an image within 30 seconds for pennies a day? What's even worse about your point is at this point no one doubts that computer based Chess players are far better than everyone else. The scale of which GPT it giving out 'different' answers to large numbers of people would make you wonder where this gigantic call center is at filled with people typing the responses. I mean, I think it would leak pretty quick. At this point I believe you've fallen into paranoia.
      - steponlego 4y ago
        I never accused anybody of anything, I just said that, in theory, this could all be an elaborate hoax and without my own ability to run the software on my own machine, inspect, change, and adapt it, unplugged from the Internet, there's no proof whatsoever that it's NOT an elaborate hoax. With the tens, possibly hundreds of billions of dollars, maybe trillions, on the line? This exact script played out before. Except it was pure 100% hype without even the technical possibility of human intervention because of course the Internet was barely a thing then. Show us the AI BOX. Put it in a Faraday cage and give it an optical interface to a VT-100 terminal. Until then I call, possible bullshit. One thing I've wondered - what's the differece between a model and a proprietary blob? It's "magic code." Did you train your model? It's tough, you get gnarly results.

steponlego 4y ago

I haven't access to the interal workings of OpenAI, despite the name it's all proprietary, so there's really no way I can test this and neither can you. It could all be written by humans for all anybody knows. Or just some. Neither you nor I have any way to tell other than by applying Turing tests or what have you.

pixl97 4y ago
I mean, some skepticism is good, but at some point hanlon's razor really starts to go against you.... OpenAI has had a large investment by Microsoft, and in turn is using a lot of Microsofts cloud computing resources. In fact Microsoft thought what they were doing was interesting enough they built their own 'BingChat' layer over the technology. Now, Microsoft could have gone in half blind completely unware that OpenAI was farming this off to an absolutely massive number of humans answering the questions, but doesn't that seem a little, um questionable as it's very likely that Microsoft is hosting it's own instances of the software? At this point I think your disagreement with what is occurring is drifting from 'this company is lying about what is going on' to the place of 'software is starting to make me feel deeply uncomfortable with my place in this universe'.
- steponlego 4y ago
  All I'm saying is simply a logical fact - that you and I can't prove this thing is doing what it says in a way we can independently verify. It reminds me of Kasparov and the Machine, the movie which documented the famous chess match between IBM and Kasparov. They initially promised the thing wouldn't be hooked to a network, then they hooked it to the network after it started to lose and it finally won. Kasparov, before learning they had hooked it up, complained that the moves seemed to him to be as if a committee of his rivals had teamed up against him, and as the documentary showed, indeed IBM had recruited just the team of rivals he fingered to guide IBM's team. AI grifting is an ancient Big Tech trick, going back to before most of HN was even born. There are other examples of this but one should be skeptical about AI unless it's laid bare in the form of portable, Free source code one can inspect and run even in isolation from the Internet for one's self. The fact that people dumped money into it is not proof or even evidence that it works properly or at all.
  - pixl97 4y ago
    So all transformer models recently are just grift and making stuff up? Like the model of stable diffusion pumping out art on my GPU is actually making calls where Indian kids are frantically scrabbling in paint to return an image within 30 seconds for pennies a day? What's even worse about your point is at this point no one doubts that computer based Chess players are far better than everyone else. The scale of which GPT it giving out 'different' answers to large numbers of people would make you wonder where this gigantic call center is at filled with people typing the responses. I mean, I think it would leak pretty quick. At this point I believe you've fallen into paranoia.
    - steponlego 4y ago
      I never accused anybody of anything, I just said that, in theory, this could all be an elaborate hoax and without my own ability to run the software on my own machine, inspect, change, and adapt it, unplugged from the Internet, there's no proof whatsoever that it's NOT an elaborate hoax. With the tens, possibly hundreds of billions of dollars, maybe trillions, on the line? This exact script played out before. Except it was pure 100% hype without even the technical possibility of human intervention because of course the Internet was barely a thing then. Show us the AI BOX. Put it in a Faraday cage and give it an optical interface to a VT-100 terminal. Until then I call, possible bullshit. One thing I've wondered - what's the differece between a model and a proprietary blob? It's "magic code." Did you train your model? It's tough, you get gnarly results.