6 ms·

> Portugal is a small country of 10 million with another 450 million people entitled to move there freely without visas For a stay of up to three months[0], ye

> Portugal is a small country of 10 million with another 450 million people entitled to move there freely without visas For a stay of up to three months[0], yes. Remember that when people talk about freedom of movement within the EU it's actually the free movement of workers[1], meaning beyond three months, you have to meet certain conditions, and will likely need to demonstrate you have income/employment/insurance/social security/pension... [0] https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/policies/justice-and-fundamental-rights/eu-citizenship/movement-and-residence_en https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/policies/ju... [1] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/factsheets/en/sheet/41/free-movement-of-workers https://www.europarl.europa.eu/factsheets/en/sheet/41/free-m...

mytailorisrich 4y ago
That's academic. Apart from very rare cases where someone has been deemed an "unreasonable burden" (e.g. homeless creating problems) no-one is going to be deported. In fact no-one tracks who's in the country and how long they stay. Certainly, for the purpose of this discussion the point is that anyone who's got EEA or Swiss citizenship can freely move and live in Portugal. So if some people in Portugal think they are being overwhelmed there is actually little they can do.
- logifail 4y ago
  > That's academic Are you suggesting that EU citizens are allowed to stay for more than 3 months in Portugal without a residency certificate? > In fact no-one tracks who's in the country and how long they stay This is typically completely fine, right up until the moment anyone in authority gets a reason to start asking questions: "When did you arrive in Portugal, mytailorisrich?" "Ah, over three months ago. Can you show me your residency certificate?" <sucks air through teeth> "Can you explain why you didn't get a residency certificate?"
  - netsharc 4y ago
    In practice EU people would be free to lie about when they arrived, your EU passport don't get stamped when entering another EU country. You don't even need a passport, your ID card is sufficient for travelling inside the EU.
    - the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
      I have no experience with Portugal, but the vast majority of deporations in Austria are other EU citizens who stay for longer than three months without permanent registration. You need to show proof of being able to support yourself to move to other EU countries.
      - haspok 4y ago
        First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? (Assuming of course that you are staying in hotels and airbnbs, or even at relatives / friends - of course, if you rent and register officially then it is obvious.)
        the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
        > First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? It's not like police is ramping up people who stand somewhere for longer than N months. These cases typically come up because people end up homeless, are trying to start claiming benefits, are dodging taxes or are otherwise appearing in front of the authorities.
        popcalc 4y ago
        >First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? At least here in the democratic republic of Hungary: Cell network subscriber logs, ATM/POS flags, the passport number you enter when getting your public transit pass, the filed invoice the phone repair shop fills out when you get your battery replaced. If you're a backpacking 20 year old it's very unlikely anything will happen to you, but if you're running a business or a "digital nomad" making FAANG salaries you'll get a rude awakening one morning with a knock on the door.
  - dotemacs 4y ago
    mytailorisrich shurgs. Nothing happens. Or what would happen?
_visgean 4y ago
> the EU it's actually the free movement of workers You can also be self-employed in that country or a student. So it does not apply just for workers. My guess is that its written in that way to give police power to remove homeless people from different countries.
- logifail 4y ago
  I think it's more abstract, it's the freedom of movement for work. Despite what some may think, students do work. At least some of the time :) > homeless people Not wishing to sound negative, but when the Treaty of Rome was signed, way way back in 1957, I doubt anyone was thinking about the homeless.
- patall 4y ago
  As I understand it, that rule exists to stop people from moving 'on paper' to collect social security in a rich country while they keep living in a lower cost of living area. Which is nevertheless seems to be quite an issue in some countries. (Not that your explanation is automatically wrong)

mytailorisrich 4y ago

That's academic. Apart from very rare cases where someone has been deemed an "unreasonable burden" (e.g. homeless creating problems) no-one is going to be deported. In fact no-one tracks who's in the country and how long they stay. Certainly, for the purpose of this discussion the point is that anyone who's got EEA or Swiss citizenship can freely move and live in Portugal. So if some people in Portugal think they are being overwhelmed there is actually little they can do.

logifail 4y ago
> That's academic Are you suggesting that EU citizens are allowed to stay for more than 3 months in Portugal without a residency certificate? > In fact no-one tracks who's in the country and how long they stay This is typically completely fine, right up until the moment anyone in authority gets a reason to start asking questions: "When did you arrive in Portugal, mytailorisrich?" "Ah, over three months ago. Can you show me your residency certificate?" <sucks air through teeth> "Can you explain why you didn't get a residency certificate?"
- netsharc 4y ago
  In practice EU people would be free to lie about when they arrived, your EU passport don't get stamped when entering another EU country. You don't even need a passport, your ID card is sufficient for travelling inside the EU.
  - the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
    I have no experience with Portugal, but the vast majority of deporations in Austria are other EU citizens who stay for longer than three months without permanent registration. You need to show proof of being able to support yourself to move to other EU countries.
    - haspok 4y ago
      First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? (Assuming of course that you are staying in hotels and airbnbs, or even at relatives / friends - of course, if you rent and register officially then it is obvious.)
      - the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
        > First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? It's not like police is ramping up people who stand somewhere for longer than N months. These cases typically come up because people end up homeless, are trying to start claiming benefits, are dodging taxes or are otherwise appearing in front of the authorities.
      - popcalc 4y ago
        >First they need to show proof that you are staying there for longer than allowed. How do they do that? At least here in the democratic republic of Hungary: Cell network subscriber logs, ATM/POS flags, the passport number you enter when getting your public transit pass, the filed invoice the phone repair shop fills out when you get your battery replaced. If you're a backpacking 20 year old it's very unlikely anything will happen to you, but if you're running a business or a "digital nomad" making FAANG salaries you'll get a rude awakening one morning with a knock on the door.
- dotemacs 4y ago
  mytailorisrich shurgs. Nothing happens. Or what would happen?

_visgean 4y ago

> the EU it's actually the free movement of workers You can also be self-employed in that country or a student. So it does not apply just for workers. My guess is that its written in that way to give police power to remove homeless people from different countries.

logifail 4y ago
I think it's more abstract, it's the freedom of movement for work. Despite what some may think, students do work. At least some of the time :) > homeless people Not wishing to sound negative, but when the Treaty of Rome was signed, way way back in 1957, I doubt anyone was thinking about the homeless.
patall 4y ago
As I understand it, that rule exists to stop people from moving 'on paper' to collect social security in a rich country while they keep living in a lower cost of living area. Which is nevertheless seems to be quite an issue in some countries. (Not that your explanation is automatically wrong)