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You haven't justified the claim that "always being under surveillance" is categorically a bad thing. If you refuse to do that, you're kind of breaking the soci

by Zetice 4y ago

You haven't justified the claim that "always being under surveillance" is categorically a bad thing. If you refuse to do that, you're kind of breaking the social contract around communication. Why share this belief if you can't defend it? And what you sacrifice is a lot of convenience, and a wholesale rejection by the very society you rely heavily on to survive. It's not tenable to live in this society and wear a ski mask while shopping in a grocery store.

JohnFen 4y ago
> You haven't justified the claim that "always being under surveillance" is categorically a bad thing. I don't have to. It's sufficient for me to say that I strongly dislike it. > Why share this belief if you can't defend it? Why do you think this is something that needs defending? Regardless, I think I have adequately defended it. It's an intrusion into my life that I don't consent to and I find highly objectionable. The reason I find it objectionable is exactly the same as the reason I object to someone following me around writing down everything I do, or peering into my windows at home. > And what you sacrifice is a lot of convenience, and a wholesale rejection by the very society you rely heavily on to survive. Neither of those things are true at all. I do not feel greatly inconvenienced, and I fully participate in society. > It's not tenable to live in this society and wear a ski mask while shopping in a grocery store. I agree. I don't do that. That said, if I'm aware that a store is engaging in facial recognition, I will choose to shop at a store that doesn't. That, too, is engaging in the society I live in.
- deleted 4y ago
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- Zetice 4y ago
  If it doesn't matter to you if you're understood, then you're just commenting for attention, and there's no point in reading anything else you write...
  - JohnFen 4y ago
    Obviously, it does matter to me if I'm understood. What I'm not understanding is what it is I'm not being clear about. Edit: I think part of the problem we're having in our communication is that we're both coming from angles that are alien to each other, and haven't really worked out what each other is saying. For instance, the questions you are asking me are difficult for me to answer directly because they make no sense to me in the context of this issue. I've been trying to interpret them in such a way that I can provide useful answers, but clearly I've failed. I suspect that's because we each have very different underlying assumptions.

by Zetice 4y ago

JohnFen 4y ago

> You haven't justified the claim that "always being under surveillance" is categorically a bad thing. I don't have to. It's sufficient for me to say that I strongly dislike it. > Why share this belief if you can't defend it? Why do you think this is something that needs defending? Regardless, I think I have adequately defended it. It's an intrusion into my life that I don't consent to and I find highly objectionable. The reason I find it objectionable is exactly the same as the reason I object to someone following me around writing down everything I do, or peering into my windows at home. > And what you sacrifice is a lot of convenience, and a wholesale rejection by the very society you rely heavily on to survive. Neither of those things are true at all. I do not feel greatly inconvenienced, and I fully participate in society. > It's not tenable to live in this society and wear a ski mask while shopping in a grocery store. I agree. I don't do that. That said, if I'm aware that a store is engaging in facial recognition, I will choose to shop at a store that doesn't. That, too, is engaging in the society I live in.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Zetice 4y ago
If it doesn't matter to you if you're understood, then you're just commenting for attention, and there's no point in reading anything else you write...
- JohnFen 4y ago
  Obviously, it does matter to me if I'm understood. What I'm not understanding is what it is I'm not being clear about. Edit: I think part of the problem we're having in our communication is that we're both coming from angles that are alien to each other, and haven't really worked out what each other is saying. For instance, the questions you are asking me are difficult for me to answer directly because they make no sense to me in the context of this issue. I've been trying to interpret them in such a way that I can provide useful answers, but clearly I've failed. I suspect that's because we each have very different underlying assumptions.