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Your comment reinforces what I was already going to say — correlation != causation, and in fact, I think in this case they have it backwards. You suggest that

Your comment reinforces what I was already going to say — correlation != causation, and in fact, I think in this case they have it backwards. You suggest that you are happier because you have cut down on your exposure to advertising and “inadequacy content”, and this has resulted in a drop in expenditures, rather than frugality directly being the thing that resulted in happiness. It’s the same in my case - I decided, quite a few years ago, that chasing status was a sucker’s game, and stopped buying crap that signalled status. I drive a truck that’s older than me, live in a 45m2 log cabin I built myself, wear clothes that were barely fashionable 20 years ago, if I’m even bothering with clothes, and spend my days doing whatever the hell I choose, because it turns out that by not engaging in the consumer mill you suddenly have all this cash sitting around and not much to do with it, so you invest it, and suddenly spending your life working and chasing status in some career or another also seems a lot less appealing. I’ve never been terribly happy with myself, which is just a de facto part of my nature — but I’m certainly content with my existence, and knowing that I’ve got a war chest tucked away that would make Croesus blush amply fulfils any status desires, as if I chose to, I could buy a few thousand teslas and drive them into the sea, and just carry on as I am. I believe the term is “fuck you money”, and it beats the crap out of having some shiny bauble on hire-purchase. I don’t even think about it until I find myself on the receiving end of “oh, you must be so poor to live this way, why don’t you work harder or get a new car”, and I just smile and remind myself that I could probably buy their mortal soul. It’s also eminently achievable for anyone on a halfway decent income, if they stop frittering it away on crap. The only thing that I do from time to time spend cash on is the occasional adventure. People tell me I should do a YouTube channel, or an instagram, and I tell them that I’m not doing this for anyone but me and those I take along with me. I don’t give a tiny flying rat’s ass about “personal brand”. Stuff doesn’t bring joy. Status, as it’s sold via the drip drip drip of planned obsolescence doesn’t either. Security and freedom and time, do.

NemoNobody 4y ago
Don't forget how it all went down for Croesus
- madaxe_again 4y ago
  He was burned at the stake by Cyrus after his ill-advised invasion of Persia? I have no plans on any oracular conquests.
notch898a 4y ago
How does one live in a 45m^2 self built house when all the jobs are in places with insane building codes requiring 1200 sq ft minimum house complete with sewage/septic permit? You may be able to get away with that if you don't have a family but if you do sooner or later other kids will find out, your kid will be ratted out to social services for living in an "illegal shelter" which the social worker will deem inadequate and demand they be moved or taken away. The city will bulldoze the house and fine the everliving shit out of you. Meanwhile you still have to pay property taxes, and for at least some of your food, which means you need a job. And because you have a job you need childcare. So minimally you need to pay for the property taxes food and childcare, occasional medical bills, the upkeep of the truck (emissions testing needed to legally drive to get groceries etc, so even a check engine light means costly repair). Oh and don't forget, when I was looking for a truck "older than me" during covid I found the market was absolutely insane and they were practically the price of a new truck. All in that's a full working-class salary right there, and that's with spending on nothing but essentials. As an extremely frugal person the only way I've ever been able to live the way you live was when I was single and basically squatting in the national forest. And even then I had LEO up my ass threatening to cite me for illegally existing in nature. Hopefully any American planning this life has the money to emigrate or the will and craftiness to do it illegally.
- madaxe_again 4y ago
  No job, no need, and the house is entirely legal, including the septic system and other infrastructure I’ve built, and I have a kid. Also good fucking luck to anyone wanting to get a bulldozer there - it’s on a 45 degree hill slope with no road access. The truck was €4,000, and it’s a hilux. I could set it on fire and it would be fine. The property taxes are €40 a year for the house, the mill, the ruined medieval village, and the 15ha of land. My passive income is seven figures, because rather than fritter away on crap, I invested in a diverse range of stuff, from equities to real estate to small businesses/startups. I’m noodling about with a few new ventures of my own as I have time on my hands. And yes, emigration is useful. I draw an income from expensive economies and moved to a cheap country where quality of life is king. To be clear, this is the current state - I worked my arse off for 15 years and lived a pretty monkish existence, and now reap the rewards.
jeffwask 4y ago
> It’s the same in my case - I decided, quite a few years ago, that chasing status was a sucker’s game, and stopped buying crap that signalled status. I have friends who make over $200k in affordable areas that constantly complain about money but buy new cars every 2 years, spend $1000's on lego sets, buy expensive toys they sell for 2/3-1/2 value within two years (campers, digital home gyms, etc), need the latest TV, Monitor, Phone... it never ends. It's not filling a need or solving a problem. It's just high price branded junk that they can pose next to on Facebook or Instagram.

NemoNobody 4y ago

Don't forget how it all went down for Croesus

madaxe_again 4y ago
He was burned at the stake by Cyrus after his ill-advised invasion of Persia? I have no plans on any oracular conquests.

notch898a 4y ago

How does one live in a 45m^2 self built house when all the jobs are in places with insane building codes requiring 1200 sq ft minimum house complete with sewage/septic permit? You may be able to get away with that if you don't have a family but if you do sooner or later other kids will find out, your kid will be ratted out to social services for living in an "illegal shelter" which the social worker will deem inadequate and demand they be moved or taken away. The city will bulldoze the house and fine the everliving shit out of you. Meanwhile you still have to pay property taxes, and for at least some of your food, which means you need a job. And because you have a job you need childcare. So minimally you need to pay for the property taxes food and childcare, occasional medical bills, the upkeep of the truck (emissions testing needed to legally drive to get groceries etc, so even a check engine light means costly repair). Oh and don't forget, when I was looking for a truck "older than me" during covid I found the market was absolutely insane and they were practically the price of a new truck. All in that's a full working-class salary right there, and that's with spending on nothing but essentials. As an extremely frugal person the only way I've ever been able to live the way you live was when I was single and basically squatting in the national forest. And even then I had LEO up my ass threatening to cite me for illegally existing in nature. Hopefully any American planning this life has the money to emigrate or the will and craftiness to do it illegally.

madaxe_again 4y ago
No job, no need, and the house is entirely legal, including the septic system and other infrastructure I’ve built, and I have a kid. Also good fucking luck to anyone wanting to get a bulldozer there - it’s on a 45 degree hill slope with no road access. The truck was €4,000, and it’s a hilux. I could set it on fire and it would be fine. The property taxes are €40 a year for the house, the mill, the ruined medieval village, and the 15ha of land. My passive income is seven figures, because rather than fritter away on crap, I invested in a diverse range of stuff, from equities to real estate to small businesses/startups. I’m noodling about with a few new ventures of my own as I have time on my hands. And yes, emigration is useful. I draw an income from expensive economies and moved to a cheap country where quality of life is king. To be clear, this is the current state - I worked my arse off for 15 years and lived a pretty monkish existence, and now reap the rewards.

jeffwask 4y ago

> It’s the same in my case - I decided, quite a few years ago, that chasing status was a sucker’s game, and stopped buying crap that signalled status. I have friends who make over $200k in affordable areas that constantly complain about money but buy new cars every 2 years, spend $1000's on lego sets, buy expensive toys they sell for 2/3-1/2 value within two years (campers, digital home gyms, etc), need the latest TV, Monitor, Phone... it never ends. It's not filling a need or solving a problem. It's just high price branded junk that they can pose next to on Facebook or Instagram.