8 ms·

YouTube has been riding it's content momentum for too long. It really needs a change of leadership to continue to innovate. For some searches, it's baffling th

by neosat 4y ago

YouTube has been riding it's content momentum for too long. It really needs a change of leadership to continue to innovate. For some searches, it's baffling that the top results are clearly intuitively wrong (e.g. showing videos where dislike to like ratio is very high, compared to clearly better alternatives that you can find if you wade through the results)

ignoramous 4y ago
I thought YouTube did really well under Wojcicki's leadership.
- gjsman-1000 4y ago
  Well.... not really. - Why does seemingly every channel I follow, whether it be JCS Criminal Psychology or The 8-bit Guy, have to mention the YouTube Algorithm, Content ID, Copyright Strikes, or Community Guidelines? If almost every creator is struggling and not just the fringe and edgy, you've screwed up big time. - Removal of the dislike count. Extremely unpopular decision. Also YouTube's API is still answering dislike counts making extensions to bring it back still function, despite over a year later, almost implying it was about keeping up appearances. Now... who could be so worried about keeping up appearances... - Completely blowing up YouTube Rewind into an increasingly corporate affair that quickly started heading downhill until the absolute train wreck of 2018, where it became the most disliked video in YouTube history at that point. This was, in part, because YouTube basically sanitized it of the presence of the popular YouTubers at the time because they might not be advertiser-friendly. Rewind never recovered and YouTube has now given up trying to engage with the community in such a way. - Taking a 5-second ad at the beginning of her tenure, and leaving it with multiple, constant, unskippable, rampant advertising; and a subscription plan that started at $10/mo. turning into $23/mo. for equivalent service (5 users). - Launched YouTube Kids to provide a curated experience for younger individuals, then decided to make it run on automation. Which then screwed up big time and started serving kids extremely inappropriate content causing a brief congressional inquiry. Then YouTube settled as guilty to violating COPAA, and decided to shift all the responsibility on the creators by disabling comments and other features on any video that may possibly be seen by kids. Some "success"...
  - blululu 4y ago
    FWIW I think there are more or less two very distinct experiences/use cycles of YouTube. There is the one where people get to it from outside (mostly Google Search) and the one where people get to it from within YouTube itself. As someone who falls into the casual Google search category the latter class of serious YouTube user is just alien to me. The 2018 Rewind video was pretty bonkers stupid to me, but, to me, it also looks more or less the same as the 2017 rewind video. How you feel about YouTube is probably a function of how you use it.
  - johannes1234321 4y ago
    > If almost every creator is struggling and not just the fringe and edgy, you've screwed up big time. Whatever algorithm YouTube uses professional uploaders will try to maximize their views, which goes by acting as the algorithm requires. In a competitive environment there is a inherent struggle.
chippiewill 4y ago
> showing videos where dislike to like ratio is very high That's because Youtube prioritizes engagement over quality. You make more money that way.
- GVIrish 4y ago
  Bingo. This has made me spend a lot less time on Youtube because recommended content and search are worse for me. If I'm searching for a marine biology video I don't want to see recommendations for clickbait influencers 3 results in. I used to go down random rabbit holes when I found related interesting content, but now that just doesn't happen very much anymore.
moffkalast 4y ago
> to continue to innovate Like they innovated by blatantly ripping off tiktok and added "shorts"? Yeah best if they just stay exactly what they are.
- moremetadata 4y ago
  I'm noticing that traditional media & news outlets are getting their idea's from what is popular on social media outlets like Youtube. Example: https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the-piano https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the-piano https://youtu.be/ljjWeHmeVE8?t=157 https://youtu.be/ljjWeHmeVE8?t=157 https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pub+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pub+piano+playi... https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=shopping+mall+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=shopping+mall+p... https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=public+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=public+piano+pl...
ren_engineer 4y ago
YT search is dogshit now, rather than just returning results for the keyword you want they mix in random videos you've watched before and "suggested" videos that have no relation to the search and the lack of likes/dislikes makes it harder to determine quality, which is probably some dark pattern to try and drive more engagement by forcing people to watch multiple videos. Dark patterns work short term, long term they result in TikTok or the equivalent eating your market share
- seydor 4y ago
  It's also not SHORTS really trying SHORTS to mix its content nicely SHORTS because i seem to find its recommendations boring SHORTS and often can't find videos that SHORTS i know should be there. Maybe SHORTS i should be using bing search to find youtube videos. Yandex also has a nice video search
  - 411111111111111 4y ago
    And if you start browsing shorts you're bound to get the same <9 creators ad nauseam with duplicates mixed in all the time. It's a terrible experience, honestly.
    - sph 4y ago
      The YT recommendation system is basically "we know what you want to watch better than you do", so it keeps blatantly ignoring any opposite signal. No, I do not want to watch wedding videos that I've said I'm not interested in at least 50 times. No, there isn't anyone in my household watching wedding videos. No, I do not want to rewatch a 6 hour long lecture I watched last month. Yet it just doesn't bloody care. I am truly terrified to click on anything outside my regular comfort zone for fear that that's what I'll be recommended for the next 12 months. Youtube is the worst product I have to keep paying for — I tried going adblock, but good luck if you have Apple devices. I'd rather be held hostage to Youtube Premium than being brainwashed with ads every 5 minutes.
  - cuteboy19 4y ago
progbits 4y ago
Why does everything have to keep innovating? Youtube was fine years ago. People make stuff, I subscribe and watch it. Sure throw in some algorithmic discovery on the side. Bring back dislike count. Other than that I don't care for any innovation. Just keep the lights on.
- mdgrech23 4y ago
  yea I'm a daily users of YT. Pay for premium. Don't produce. Only consume. Probably their ideal customer and I think the app is great. No idea what people are bitching about.
  - Workaccount2 4y ago
    The main criticism I see with YouTube is that it has too many ads, and the idea of paying for youtube is laughable. Basically, it's users are very entitled. Edit: I have had premium since day 1, I'm speaking about others.
    - voydik 4y ago
      Paying for YouTube Premium has been the best $15/month I've ever spent. What's laughable is not paying for it. It's a good model that works.
      - atlgator 4y ago
        You can save $3/mo by canceling your subscription through Apple and subscribing directly through the YouTube’s website ($11.99). Avoids the Apple tax.
      - justapassenger 4y ago
        Seriously, if you spend any meaningful time on it, premium is amazing deal. Variety of the content is unbeatable.
      - Hikikomori 4y ago
        There's premium lite for like half the price as well.
intrasight 4y ago
For me, as a consumer of video content that I find with google video search, YouTube is just a video host and no different than any other video host that Google crawl. The vast majority of those searches for me pertain to hands-on DIY projects where videos are very useful to learn how to perform some process - like laying floors (a recent one for me). I would never visit youtube.com directly as I've learned that it's incentives are very different. But most of the really useful content that I find is in fact hosted on YouTube, so the service is in fact extremely useful for DIYers. And I do often find in those videos tools or supplies that make sense to purchase, and I often click on the producers affiliate links in the video.
zxienin 4y ago
Change of leadership is not necessarily = innovation
c3534l 4y ago
Downvotes are hidden now. I'm not sure they actually have enough information to determine video quality anymore. Its all about gaming the algorithm's "engagement" metrics. No one cares if you enjoyed yourself any longer.
- ajhurliman 4y ago
  The dislike button is still there, they just don’t want to show the results to advertisers. If advertisers can see the ratio, they start complaining about being associated with “problematic “ content. They probably want to show viewers, but you can’t reveal the stats to only one group.
  - c3534l 4y ago
    Yeah, but because its hidden, people don't use it anymore.
theGnuMe 4y ago
By all metrics except TikTok YouTube is the 900 pound gorilla eating streaming.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

by neosat 4y ago

ignoramous 4y ago

I thought YouTube did really well under Wojcicki's leadership.

gjsman-1000 4y ago
Well.... not really. - Why does seemingly every channel I follow, whether it be JCS Criminal Psychology or The 8-bit Guy, have to mention the YouTube Algorithm, Content ID, Copyright Strikes, or Community Guidelines? If almost every creator is struggling and not just the fringe and edgy, you've screwed up big time. - Removal of the dislike count. Extremely unpopular decision. Also YouTube's API is still answering dislike counts making extensions to bring it back still function, despite over a year later, almost implying it was about keeping up appearances. Now... who could be so worried about keeping up appearances... - Completely blowing up YouTube Rewind into an increasingly corporate affair that quickly started heading downhill until the absolute train wreck of 2018, where it became the most disliked video in YouTube history at that point. This was, in part, because YouTube basically sanitized it of the presence of the popular YouTubers at the time because they might not be advertiser-friendly. Rewind never recovered and YouTube has now given up trying to engage with the community in such a way. - Taking a 5-second ad at the beginning of her tenure, and leaving it with multiple, constant, unskippable, rampant advertising; and a subscription plan that started at $10/mo. turning into $23/mo. for equivalent service (5 users). - Launched YouTube Kids to provide a curated experience for younger individuals, then decided to make it run on automation. Which then screwed up big time and started serving kids extremely inappropriate content causing a brief congressional inquiry. Then YouTube settled as guilty to violating COPAA, and decided to shift all the responsibility on the creators by disabling comments and other features on any video that may possibly be seen by kids. Some "success"...
- blululu 4y ago
  FWIW I think there are more or less two very distinct experiences/use cycles of YouTube. There is the one where people get to it from outside (mostly Google Search) and the one where people get to it from within YouTube itself. As someone who falls into the casual Google search category the latter class of serious YouTube user is just alien to me. The 2018 Rewind video was pretty bonkers stupid to me, but, to me, it also looks more or less the same as the 2017 rewind video. How you feel about YouTube is probably a function of how you use it.
- johannes1234321 4y ago
  > If almost every creator is struggling and not just the fringe and edgy, you've screwed up big time. Whatever algorithm YouTube uses professional uploaders will try to maximize their views, which goes by acting as the algorithm requires. In a competitive environment there is a inherent struggle.

chippiewill 4y ago

> showing videos where dislike to like ratio is very high That's because Youtube prioritizes engagement over quality. You make more money that way.

GVIrish 4y ago
Bingo. This has made me spend a lot less time on Youtube because recommended content and search are worse for me. If I'm searching for a marine biology video I don't want to see recommendations for clickbait influencers 3 results in. I used to go down random rabbit holes when I found related interesting content, but now that just doesn't happen very much anymore.

moffkalast 4y ago

> to continue to innovate Like they innovated by blatantly ripping off tiktok and added "shorts"? Yeah best if they just stay exactly what they are.

moremetadata 4y ago
I'm noticing that traditional media & news outlets are getting their idea's from what is popular on social media outlets like Youtube. Example: https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the-piano https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the-piano https://youtu.be/ljjWeHmeVE8?t=157 https://youtu.be/ljjWeHmeVE8?t=157 https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pub+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pub+piano+playi... https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=shopping+mall+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=shopping+mall+p... https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=public+piano+playing https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=public+piano+pl...

ren_engineer 4y ago

YT search is dogshit now, rather than just returning results for the keyword you want they mix in random videos you've watched before and "suggested" videos that have no relation to the search and the lack of likes/dislikes makes it harder to determine quality, which is probably some dark pattern to try and drive more engagement by forcing people to watch multiple videos. Dark patterns work short term, long term they result in TikTok or the equivalent eating your market share

seydor 4y ago
It's also not SHORTS really trying SHORTS to mix its content nicely SHORTS because i seem to find its recommendations boring SHORTS and often can't find videos that SHORTS i know should be there. Maybe SHORTS i should be using bing search to find youtube videos. Yandex also has a nice video search
- 411111111111111 4y ago
  And if you start browsing shorts you're bound to get the same <9 creators ad nauseam with duplicates mixed in all the time. It's a terrible experience, honestly.
  - sph 4y ago
    The YT recommendation system is basically "we know what you want to watch better than you do", so it keeps blatantly ignoring any opposite signal. No, I do not want to watch wedding videos that I've said I'm not interested in at least 50 times. No, there isn't anyone in my household watching wedding videos. No, I do not want to rewatch a 6 hour long lecture I watched last month. Yet it just doesn't bloody care. I am truly terrified to click on anything outside my regular comfort zone for fear that that's what I'll be recommended for the next 12 months. Youtube is the worst product I have to keep paying for — I tried going adblock, but good luck if you have Apple devices. I'd rather be held hostage to Youtube Premium than being brainwashed with ads every 5 minutes.
- cuteboy19 4y ago

progbits 4y ago

Why does everything have to keep innovating? Youtube was fine years ago. People make stuff, I subscribe and watch it. Sure throw in some algorithmic discovery on the side. Bring back dislike count. Other than that I don't care for any innovation. Just keep the lights on.

mdgrech23 4y ago
yea I'm a daily users of YT. Pay for premium. Don't produce. Only consume. Probably their ideal customer and I think the app is great. No idea what people are bitching about.
- Workaccount2 4y ago
  The main criticism I see with YouTube is that it has too many ads, and the idea of paying for youtube is laughable. Basically, it's users are very entitled. Edit: I have had premium since day 1, I'm speaking about others.
  - voydik 4y ago
    Paying for YouTube Premium has been the best $15/month I've ever spent. What's laughable is not paying for it. It's a good model that works.
    - atlgator 4y ago
      You can save $3/mo by canceling your subscription through Apple and subscribing directly through the YouTube’s website ($11.99). Avoids the Apple tax.
    - justapassenger 4y ago
      Seriously, if you spend any meaningful time on it, premium is amazing deal. Variety of the content is unbeatable.
    - Hikikomori 4y ago
      There's premium lite for like half the price as well.

intrasight 4y ago

For me, as a consumer of video content that I find with google video search, YouTube is just a video host and no different than any other video host that Google crawl. The vast majority of those searches for me pertain to hands-on DIY projects where videos are very useful to learn how to perform some process - like laying floors (a recent one for me). I would never visit youtube.com directly as I've learned that it's incentives are very different. But most of the really useful content that I find is in fact hosted on YouTube, so the service is in fact extremely useful for DIYers. And I do often find in those videos tools or supplies that make sense to purchase, and I often click on the producers affiliate links in the video.

zxienin 4y ago

Change of leadership is not necessarily = innovation

c3534l 4y ago

Downvotes are hidden now. I'm not sure they actually have enough information to determine video quality anymore. Its all about gaming the algorithm's "engagement" metrics. No one cares if you enjoyed yourself any longer.

ajhurliman 4y ago
The dislike button is still there, they just don’t want to show the results to advertisers. If advertisers can see the ratio, they start complaining about being associated with “problematic “ content. They probably want to show viewers, but you can’t reveal the stats to only one group.
- c3534l 4y ago
  Yeah, but because its hidden, people don't use it anymore.

theGnuMe 4y ago

By all metrics except TikTok YouTube is the 900 pound gorilla eating streaming.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]